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Doddler
08-28-2008, 08:59 AM
This is an old thread, the new thread is here:

http://forums.irowiki.org/showthread.php?t=24798

Important Note: This balance update is still in testing. While you may not like the changes, please discuss them in a civil manner. If your only intention is to post here to complain about things, please do so in the Tirades thread (http://forums.irowiki.org/showthread.php?t=14201). Posts made in THIS thread simply to complain will be deleted.

Additionally, please do not ask for access to kRO accounts. Please don't PM me either, I can't create accounts on kRO.

Also please don't assume information here is correct, because it could very well not be.

On kRO on July 28th Gravity set up a new test server for their Ragnarok Renewal Project. The Renewal is a full scale re-balancing of Ragnarok. The plan is to make RO more accessible to users, and more in line with modern day MMORPG's. In addition, the new mechanics are intended so that they can easily add and improve on current game content (such as 3rd jobs) without destroying game balance.

Now the renewal balance update has completed its term of closed beta testing and now available for open testing. As testing continues, gravity continues to fine tune the system and make adjustments the game.

The previous discussion thread was becoming too large and becoming difficult to sift through information, so the discussions will be continued in this thread. The old threads are still available here (http://forums.irowiki.org/showthread.php?t=14155) and here (http://forums.irowiki.org/showthread.php?t=15359).

The following is a list of currently observed changes.



Base Stats

Strength (STR) *
- 1 point of STR increases status physical attack power by 1.2
- 5 points of STR increase status defense by 1

Agility (AGI)
- 1 point of AGI increases flee rate by 1
- 4 points of AGI increases your attack speed by 1
- 5 points of AGI increases status defense by 1

Vitality (VIT)
- 1 point of VIT increases your Max HP by 1%
- 1 point of VIT increases your recovery rate by 2%
- 2 points of VIT increases your status defense by 1
- 5 points of VIT increases your status magic defense by 1

Inteligence (INT)
- 1 point of INT decreases your variable cast time by 0.2%. - 1 point of INT increases your status magic attack by 1.5
- 2 points of INT increases your status magic defense by 1

Dexterity (DEX) *
- 1 point of DEX increases your hit rate by 1
- 1 point of DEX decreases your variable cast time by 0.4%.
- 4 points of DEX increases your status magic defense by 1
- 5 points of DEX increases your status magic attack by 1
- 10 points of DEX increases your status physical attack power by 1
- 10 points of DEX increases your attack speed by 1

Luck (LUK)
- 1 point of LUK increases your Critical by 0.3
- 3 points of LUK increases your status physical attack power by 1
- 3 points of LUK increases your status magical attack power by 1
- 3 points of LUK increases your hit by 1
- 7 points of LUK increases your flee by 1
- 10 points of LUK increases your perfect dodge by 1

Base Level
- 1 level increases your HIT rate by 1.
- 1 level increases your FLEE rate by 1.
- 4 levels increases your status ATK by 1.
- 4 levels increases your status MATK by 1.
- 6 levels increases your status DEF by 1.
- 6 levels increases your status MDEF by 1.

* With bows, guns, musical instruments and whips, the increase in physical attack power from Dex and Str are swapped, making Dex the primary damage stat.

Other Stats

Physical Attack Power (ATK)
- Shown in the status window as "status attack power + equipment attack power".
- Attack power gained by your own stats affect status attack power, and your weapon affects equipment attack power.
- Cards and equipment that affect or increase your attack power only affect your equipment attack power.

Magical Attack Power (MATK)
- Shown in the status window as "status magic attack power + equipment magic attack power".
- Magic attack power gained by your own stats affect status magic attack power, and your weapon affects equipment magic attack power.
- All weapons now have a unique magic attack stat which directly affects your equipment magic attack power when equipped.
- Cards and equipment that affect or increase your magic attack power only affect your equipment magic attack power.

Physical Defense (DEF)
- Shown in the status window as "Status defense + Equipment defense".
- Status defense is gained by your own stats, and equipment defense is increased by your current equipped gears and their refine rate.
- Physical defense directly reduces a targets attack power against you. Equipment defense however reduces damage more than your status defense.
- The difference in level between you and the opponent affect how effective your defense is at reducing damage.

Magical Defense (MDEF)
- Shown in the status window as "Status magic defense + Equipment magic defense".
- Status magic defense is gained via your stats, and equipment magic defense is increased by your current equipment and cards.
- Magical defense directly reduces a targets magic attack power against you. The reduction from equipment magic defense makes up a higher % of the total reduction.
- The difference in level between you and the opponent affect how effective your defense is at reducing damage.

Attack Speed (ASPD)
- Attack speed is displayed as a numerical value, which represents an attacking speed unchanged from before the renewal patch. As your approach 200 attack speed, your attacks become increasingly fast (max aspd is 190, representing 5 attacks a second).
- Attack speed varies from job to job, and is effected by the class of weapon equipped, your Level, AGI and DEX stats, and reduced when equipping a shield.
- Stats and and equipment that affect ASPD modify it by a direct amount instead of by a %. For example, Two-Hand Quicken will give you a flat +5 aspd.
- Equipping a shield reduces your ASPD by approximately 5.

Accuracy (HIT)
- Shown in the status window as "Status HIT + Equipment HIT bonus".
- The base status HIT is 175, and is increased by your level, Dex and Luk.
- Your status hit and equipment hit affect your final hit rate equally.

Evasion (FLEE)
- Shown in the status window as "Status FLEE + Equipment FLEE bonus".
- The base status FLEE is 100, and increased by your level, Agi, and Luk.
- Your status flee and equipment flee affect your final dodge rate equally.

Final Accuracy
- The ability to hit or dodge a target physically is based on a ratio of the HIT and FLEE between you and the target.
- As your HIT raises above the targets FLEE, it becomes increasingly difficult to dodge. The opposite is true, if the opponent has higher FLEE than you have HIT, you will have difficulty in landing a hit.
- While the base numbers for HIT and FLEE have changed, the actual formula has not changed substantially.

Casting Time
- Cast time of all skills is now composed of two parts, a fixed cast time and a variable cast time.
- Fixed cast time cannot be reduced by any means, and represents the fastest a skill can possibly be cast.
- The fixed casting portion of all skills is set to 20% of the skills total casting time. Other than skills with a fixed un-reducible cast time, there are no exceptions to the ratio of 20%/80% fixed/variable cast time.
- Variable cast time can be decreased via your DEX and INT stats, as well as equipment and skills such as Suffragium and Magic strings.
- The cast time of skills at this time during testing have not changed (with the exception of cold bolt/fire bolt/lightning bolt).

Critical Chance (Crit)
- Your critical rate is calculated the same as before, and represents a % chance to land a critical hit, affected by your LUK and current equipment.
- Your critical rate is reduced by the LUK of the target, and reduced if the target is a higher level than you.
- Katar type weapons double the effect of the crit stat.

Perfect Dodge (pDodge)
- Perfect Dodge is no longer shown within the status window.
- However pDodge works the same as before, perfect dodge is a direct % chance to evade a normal (non skill) physical attack.
- Perfect Dodge is increased with higher luck and specific equipment.

Perfect Hit (pHit)
- Perfect Hit is not displayed within the client window.
- pHit is a direct % chance to hit the target, regardless of your hit and evasion rates.
- Perfect Hit can only be gained via special equipment.

Character Leveling

Increased Weighting on Level Difference
- Players are rewarded for fighting monsters of their own level, as well as those slightly harder.
- When in combat a player or monster that is higher level receives a bonus to their hit rate, critical rate and damage, and the lower level one faces a penalty to their evasion, and physical and magical defense. The penalties increase as the level difference widens.
- If you are lower level than the monster you are killing, you receive a bonus to your experience for your kills (+1% per level difference, with +10% bonus at 5 levels).
- A player or monster being hit by a lower level target additionally receives a bonus to their defense values.
- If you are 5 or more levels below a monster, you begin to receive a 30% penalty to your damage, hit, and evasion rates.
- If you are 10 or more levels below a monster, you will receive a 60% penalty to your damage, hit and evasion rates.
- As the gap in level widens, you'll become less and less likely to be able to deal any real damage to the target monster.

- If you are between 5-8 levels above a monster, you will receive a penalty to experience gained from that monster.
- At 5 levels above the target monster, you will incur a 50% penalty to the experience gained by killing it. Each additional level reduces the experience gained by an additional 10%, capping at an 80% reduction of the total experience.

- The level penalties go both ways, so a low level monster attacking you will also receive a penalty to their damage, hit, and evasion, and you will receive a bonus to your defense.

Experience Gain
- The experience table has been drastically changed.
- Because of wide-scale modifications to monster levels, monster experience, and the weighting of your own level, the amount of base experience required to level up has dropped drastically.
- Job level requirements are balanced differently. You are likely to hit job 50 on your first job around level 50, and job 50 on your second job near level 85-90.

Experience Chart
- The following is the current known experience requirement for non-transcendent characters, along with some samples of how much experience optimal monsters give at that level.

level 1 - 550 exp
level 3 - 1500 exp
level 4 - 2200 exp (porings worth 30 exp)
level 5 - 3200 exp (fabres worth 60 exp)
level 7 - 4200 exp (hornets worth 90 exp)
level 9 - 5000 exp (hornets worth 80 exp)
level 10 - 5500 exp
level 11 - 6000 exp (rockers worth 114 exp)
level 12 - 6100 exp
level 13 - 6350 exp
level 15 - 7350 exp
level 17 - 8400 exp
level 23 - 12000 exp
level 34 - 23000 exp (coco worth 312 exp)
level 35 - 24000 exp
level 36 - 26000 exp
level 37 - 27500 exp
level 38 - 29000 exp (orc ladys worth 445 exp)
level 49 - 50500 exp (orc zombies worth 470 exp)
level 63 - 77000 exp
level 65 - 84000 exp
level 68 - 95000 exp (argiope worth 1053 exp)
level 71 - 140000 exp
level 86 - 600000 exp (soliders worth 1775 exp)
level 87 - 680000 exp
level 98 - 4000000 exp

- Transcend characters require exactly twice the experience (base and job) as non-transcend characters.

Monster Arrangement and Re-leveling
- The spawn of most monsters across the game world have been widely changed.
- Areas are changed so that maps generally group monsters of similar level together.
- To accommodate this, the stats, skills, and level of most monsters in game have been drastically altered.
- The adjustment in zones is done in such a way that players should always have a place to level their class within their level range.
- Some zones have been adjusted to be high end, with monster levels appearing above 100.

- Current known monster sense information can be found here (http://ro.doddlercon.com/renewalmonsterstats.html).
- A map of all fields, and their respective levels are shown at the end of this post.
- A map of most in game dungeons and the levels can be found here (http://ro.doddlercon.com/renewalmaps.html).

Removed Maps and Map Changes
- The following maps have been removed either temporarily or permanently as part of scaling the game world. In testing, the warps to access these maps were non existent and gravity marked these maps as removed.

gef_fild12
gef_fild14
pay_fild05
pay_fild11
cmd_fild05
yuno_fild05
yuno_fild10
hu_fild03
hu_fild07
ein_fild02
ein_fild10
ra_fild02
ra_fild07
ra_fild09
ra_fild10
ra_fild11
ra_fild13
ve_fild01
ve_fild05
um_dun01
um_dun02

- The village of Umballa now directly connects to the yggdrassil tree roots.
- The map ein_fild01 now connects to ein_fild03.
- The map ve_fild04 now connects to ve_fild06.

- The entrance to the 'Ant Hell' dungeon has been moved from moc_fild20 (Crack of Dimension) to cmd_fild08 (East Fortress Saint Darmain).

Skill Balancing

Acolyte

Heal
* The amount healed for has changed. Heal is now directly influenced by your magic attack power.
* The amount healed is no longer fixed, but is a range influenced by your stats and skill level.
* Modifiers that affected heal before will still work as they did.

Mage

Safety Wall
* When safety wall blocks the maximum number of hits, a new wall cannot be placed on that cell for a short period of time.

Fire Bolt / Cold Bolt / Lightning Bolt
* The cast time of these skills has been reduced by approximately 50%.

Knight

Two Hand Quicken
* Two Hand quicken now increases your attack speed by a fixed amount.

Priest

Suffragium
* Now only reduces the variable portion of skill casting time.

BS Sacrimenti
* Now allows attacks to bypass defense of demon / undead monsters.

Turn Undead
* The success rate of Turn Undead is changed.
* On failure the damage of Turn undead is a holy attack influenced by your magic attack power.

Wizard

Meteor Storm
* The damage of Meteor Storm is increased.

Lord of Vermilion
* The damage of Lord of Vermilion is increased.

Storm Gust
* The damage of Storm Gust is increased.
* Stormgust's chance to freeze has changed. It now is a chance to freeze per hit of stormgust. Level 1 stormgust has a 25% chance to freeze, and the chance increases at 5% per level up to 70% chance to freeze per hit with level 10.

Heaven's Drive
* The damage of Heaven's Drive is increased.

Blacksmith

Adrenaline Rush
* Adrenaline Rush now increases your attack speed by a fixed amount.

Crusader

Grand Cross
* Grand Cross is influenced by both the physical attack power and magical attack power of the user.
* Grand Cross is reduced by a combination of physical defense power and magical defense power of the target.

Spear Quicken
* Spear Quicken now increases your attack speed by a fixed amount.

Monk

Occult Impaction
* Occult Impaction is influenced by (status + equip) physical attack power and the physical equipment DEF of the target.

Mental Strength
* Instead of modifying your defense/magic defense, simply reduces all incoming damage to 1/10.

Alchemist

Acid Terror
* Acid Terror is influenced by (status + equip) physical attack power and increased by the VIT of the target.
* Acid Terror deals 1/2 damage on boss targets now.

Bomb
* Bomb is now influenced by (status + equip) physical attack power.

Bard

Impressive Rift
* Impressive Rift now increases attack speed by a fixed amount (per level).

Magic Strings
* Now only reduces the variable portion of skill casting time.

Lord Knight

Frenzy
* Frenzy now increases attack speed by a fixed amount.

Clashing Spiral
* Clashing Spiral is now influenced by (status + equip) physical attack power and the weight of the current equipped weapon.

Assassin Cross

Soul Destroyer
* Soul Destroyer is influenced by your physical and magical attack power.
* Soul Destroyer's damage is reduced by a combination of both physical and magical defense of the target.

Meteor Assault
* Meteor Assault is influenced by (status + equip) physical attack power.

High Priest

Assumptio
* Assumptio has been completely changed. Assumptio now increases your physical and magical defense by 100% for the skill duration. In PVP and WoE, the bonus is only 35%.
* However, skills that bypass your physical or magical defense will ignore the effects of assumptio.

High Wizard

Stave Crasher
* Stave Crasher is influenced by both the users physical attack power and magical attack power.
* Stave Crasher is reduced only by the targets physical defense.

Scholar

Soul Exhale
* The amount of SP transferable with Soul Exhale has changed. Now you cannot give a target more than 50% of their max SP with the skill.

Mind Breaker
* The damage of Mind Breaker is now influenced by (status + equip) magical attack power.

Biochemist

Acid Bomb
* Acid Bomb is now influenced by the users physical attack power, the users magical attack power, and the VIT of the target.
* Acid Bomb damage is now reducable by a combination of both physical defense and magical defense of the target.

Equipment Changes

Some pieces of equipment have been changed for the renewal patch. In particular, most rods and some books now grant equipment magic attack power.

Daggers

Ashura - 78 MAtk
Bazerald - 100 MAtk

Rods

Rod - 30 Matk
Wand - 45 Matk
Staff - 75 Matk
Wizardry Staff - 82 Matk
Gentleman's Staff - 82 Matk
Staff of Soul - 85 Matk
Divine Cross - 87 Matk
Release of Wish - 90 Matk
Staff of Wing - 90 Matk
Staff of Recovery - 90 Matk
Staff of Piercing - 95 Matk
Arc Wand - 95 Matk
Mighty Staff - 100 Matk
Wand of Occult - 105 Matk
Eraser - 110 Matk
Dark Thorn Staff - 116 Matk
Survivor's Rod - 120 Matk
Hypnotist's Staff - 120 Matk
Staff of Destruction - 145 Matk
Lich's Bone Wand - 155 Matk

Books

Hardcover Book - 25 Matk
Giant Encyclopedia - 70 Matk
Sage's Diary - 90 Matk
Magic Tactics - 92 Matk
Ancient Magic - 95 Matk

* Other books do not grant any MATK bonus.

Formulas

Weapon Attack

Min: (2*[equipAtk] + 1.5*[str + luk/3 + level/4 + str/5 + dex/10]) * SkillModifier + mastery - ArmorDef*2 -statusDef*1.5

Max: (2*[equipAtk + (weaponAtk*weaponLvl)/20] + 1.5*[str + luk/3 + level/4 + str/5 + dex/10]) * SkillModifier + mastery - ArmorDef*2 -statusDef*1.5

- Unarmed attacks substitute strangth as weapon attack, and counts as a level 1 weapon.

Magic Attack

Min: (2*(equipMatk) + 1.5*(1.5*int + luk/3 + level/4 + dex/5)) * SkillModifier - ArmorMDef*2 - statusMDef*1.5

Max: (2*(equipMatk+[weaponMatk*weaponLvl/10]) + 1.5*(1.5*int + luk/3 + level/4 + dex/5)) * SkillModifier - ArmorMDef*2 - statusMDef*1.5

Heal

Heal Amount: (MagicAttack * skillLevel) / 4 * HealBonusModifier

- MagicAttack is a number between Min and Max according to the magic attack formula.

Monster Spawn Arrangement Map

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/3108/maprenewalnp2.jpg

Also, please don't make this into a 'balance changes I want to see' thread. ^^; Keep it on topic!

Kairuni
01-16-2009, 09:58 AM
statusatk = str + luk/3 + level/4 + str/5 + dex/10
final dmg = ([(statusatk*2+[(skillatk+equipatk+upgradeatk)*element reductions*element modifier])*race reductions*size reductions*skillmodifier]-(armordef+statusdef))*skillhits

Where skillatk is from things such as masteries. Not 100% certain on this yet, but it's quite close. We still need to test where masteries come into effect in this.
This is for max attack only!

(Most multi-hit abilities have a 1.00 mod for 'skill modifier', so sonic blow would be 8 skillhits and 1.00 skillmodifier, where Bash (400% mod) would have a 4.00 skill modifier, and 1 hit, and pierce (200% per hit) would have a 2.00 mod, and 1, 2, or 3 for hits. On medium monsters, pierce should always do less than bash unless the target has no defense at all.)

Dynamo
01-16-2009, 10:05 AM
Why don't you make a topic for the news (postable only by Doddler, Atum and etc.), other for questions and answers about the renewal and other for general discussion?

Lucentos
01-16-2009, 10:38 AM
Status Atk for Guns, Bows, Whips and Instruments is: Statusatk = Dex + luk/3 + level/4 + Dex/5 + Str/10

And what about Spear Dynamo and Falcon Eyes?(Lord Knight and Sniper respective skills) How they`re counts?
How much base ASPD have all weapons? How much ASPD giving ASPD potions?

Doddler
01-16-2009, 10:39 AM
Hmm, first post needs updating. :/

*Matt*
01-16-2009, 10:41 AM
How about the status effects?

Can MDEF and LUCK still reduce the chance to be frozen and stone curse?

Pred
01-16-2009, 01:22 PM
With all the information and questions about renewal... why not just create it's own forum section, instead of just a pinned thread in the general chat section?

skidoosh
01-16-2009, 02:03 PM
With all the information and questions about renewal... why not just create it's own forum section, instead of just a pinned thread in the general chat section?

I agree.

Doddler
01-16-2009, 03:41 PM
A separate section might be appropriate.

Boni
01-16-2009, 04:12 PM
http://forums.irowiki.org/showthread.php?t=21836

kasperlcd
01-17-2009, 02:39 AM
uh because i havent kept up to date with all these renewal changes i have a question

heard a rumor that bb only works with 2hand swords can anyone c/d?

if thats true imma qq hard

Kairuni
01-17-2009, 04:40 AM
Just a rumor. I have it on my spear RK

Yralyn
01-17-2009, 07:20 AM
Any info on dual wielding ASPD?

Atum
01-17-2009, 07:46 AM
Assassin aspd:
1+10 agi 1+8 dex Awake pot
Barehand : 151
Barehand and 1 Shield : 145
Katar : 149
1 Dagger : 149
1 Sword : 141
2 Dagger : 139
1 Dagger Mainhand 1 Sword offhand : 137
1 Sword manhand 1 Dagger offhand : 131
2 Swords : 129 aspd
1 Dagger 1 Shield : 143 aspd
1 Sword 1 Shield : 135 aspd

70+10 agi 32+8 dex Awake pot
Barehand : 172
Barehand and 1 Shield : 166
Katar : 170
1 Dagger : 170
1 Sword : 162
2 Dagger : 160
1 Dagger Mainhand 1 Sword offhand : 158
1 Sword mainhand 1 Dagger offhand : 152
2 Swords : 150 aspd
1 Dagger 1 Shield : 164aspd
1 Sword 1 Shield : 156 aspd

99+10 agi 42+8 dex Awake pot
Barehand : 178
Barehand and 1 Shield : 172
Katar : 176
1 Dagger : 176
1 Sword : 168
2 Dagger : 166
1 Dagger Mainhand 1 Sword offhand : 164
1 Sword mainhand 1 Dagger offhand : 158
2 Swords : 156 aspd
1 Dagger 1 Shield : 170aspd
1 Sword 1 Shield : 162 aspd

This all is without agi or +aspd equip.
Buffs (agi bless) would add 3~4 aspd.
SinX aspd should be ~1 aspd more since they get additional +5 agi on jobbonus.

Atum
01-17-2009, 11:38 AM
A level 97/62 sniper with 41+3 vit should have 8529 hp according to doddlers calc without any hp gears.
In renewal the same sniper (97/62) has 10930 hp with the same stats (41+3 vit) and no equipment.

Vit seems to give a lot more hp now or hp-modifier for some classes have been modified.

Yoyo
01-17-2009, 12:06 PM
I don't know if it's a bug (Probably is) but using ifrit rings, a successful Spiritual Sphere Absorption triggers autocast skills (It triggered fireball, sonic blow, and the like), I'm kinda scared of it triggering asura while I'm trying to replenish SP >>'

Xxelos
01-17-2009, 12:36 PM
Spirit Sphere Absorption can trigger autocast gears. I would be SSAing during the recent Christmas event with my Antonio Hat on and had triggered both Blessing and Heal. I believe it works in a similar way as Provoke. (Interesting side note, if you get a successful SSA on a monster during a interruptable cast, it will interrupt it. lol)

Kr4t0s
01-17-2009, 01:46 PM
Assassin aspd:
1+10 agi 1+8 dex Awake pot
Barehand : 151
Barehand and 1 Shield : 145
Katar : 149
1 Dagger : 149
1 Sword : 141
2 Dagger : 139
1 Dagger Mainhand 1 Sword offhand : 137
1 Sword manhand 1 Dagger offhand : 131
2 Swords : 129 aspd
1 Dagger 1 Shield : 143 aspd
1 Sword 1 Shield : 135 aspd

70+10 agi 32+8 dex Awake pot
Barehand : 172
Barehand and 1 Shield : 166
Katar : 170
1 Dagger : 170
1 Sword : 162
2 Dagger : 160
1 Dagger Mainhand 1 Sword offhand : 158
1 Sword mainhand 1 Dagger offhand : 152
2 Swords : 150 aspd
1 Dagger 1 Shield : 164aspd
1 Sword 1 Shield : 156 aspd

99+10 agi 42+8 dex Awake pot
Barehand : 178
Barehand and 1 Shield : 172
Katar : 176
1 Dagger : 176
1 Sword : 168
2 Dagger : 166
1 Dagger Mainhand 1 Sword offhand : 164
1 Sword mainhand 1 Dagger offhand : 158
2 Swords : 156 aspd
1 Dagger 1 Shield : 170aspd
1 Sword 1 Shield : 162 aspd

This all is without agi or +aspd equip.
Buffs (agi bless) would add 3~4 aspd.
SinX aspd should be ~1 aspd more since they get additional +5 agi on jobbonus.

Ok, I really hope I'm not just pointing out the obvious or something....
Buuuuuut, I did some math, and I just wanna point out some things.

The second set increased from the first by 21 on all weapons.
The third set increased from the second by 6 on all weapons.

This shows a strong contrast to the current aspd formula. That Agi & Dex are not so related to Weapon Delay as before, that they are subtractive of eachother, not ratios.

Showing my work OLD ASPD FORMULA:
ASpd = [200 - SpeedMods * (WeaponDelay - ([WeaponDelay*Agi/25] + [WeaponDelay*Dex/100])/10)].

to simplify this down slightly.... distribute the 10, and factor the WeaponDelay... assume speed mods == 1, and get out the trunc's - for simplicity. and to seperate, I use X.

ASpd = 200 - X

X = WeaponDelay * (1 - (Agi/250 + Dex/1000)).

This shows that your Agi and Dex are a percentage reduction based off the weapon youre using. I.E.: Use different weapons, the same amount of Dex and Agi will help you differently.

Quick Math with Doddlers calc. OLD FIGURES! NOT RENEWAL!:
1 base Agi / 1 base Dex
Bare 160.3
1 dagger 151.39
2 dagger 133.28
sword 135.5
2 sword 109.7

70/40
bare 172.9 (increased from prev set +12.6)
dagger 166.88 (increased from prev set +15.49)
2 dagger 154.5 (increased from prev set +21.22)
sword 156 (increased from prev set +20.5)
2 sword 138.4 (increased from prev set +28.7)

99/99
bare 179.9 (increased from prev set +7)
dagger 175.4 (increased from prev set +8.52)
2 dagger 166.3 (increased from prev set +11.8)
sword 167.4 (increased from prev set +11.4)
2 sword 154.4 (increased from prev set +16)


In summary, the new aspd calc is something along the lines of (my guess):

X = ((Agi * ConstA) + (Dex * ConstB)) - (WeaponDelay * ConstC)

ConstA,B,C being some constants. (Like the old 1/250, 1/1000, and 1 respectively)


So agi and dex helps equally accross all weapons. Hope I helped and tried to give some insight.... somewhere. Please don't mistake my figures for fact. I'm guessing and making observations. I don't play renewal.

(trying to stop any misinterpretations)

*steps away to do some math*
*while later, I come back*

OK! I was wrong, kind of..
I still say that they are not ratios, and are subtractive...
But the agi and dex are not simply = ((Agi * ConstA) + (Dex * ConstB))

Its a lot more complicated.
Using Atums numbers I found:
ConstB = 0.933014354 = 195/209
and (get ready)
ConstA = -0.114832536 = -24 / 209

The common denominators gives me hope that I'm close, but the fact that ConstA is negative is just stupid. This would mean that with the more Agi you get your aspd goes down. I had heard in one of these threads that this does happen when allocating some points of agi. Also the fact that ConstB > ConstA means that Dex helps more than Agi. That is also stupid. This would imply that the formula between Dex and Agi is far more complex. Sadly, I do not play renewal. If someone were to pass me more statistics on aspd and more variables, I might be able to get a good formula....
Though, if some points of agi make aspd go down, the formula may still be under some work. So I don't know if its worth it to find out this (possibly retarded) formula if it were to just change not too far after.


Anyways, theres my discoveries. Hope it helped a little. If anyone wants to toss me some figures, I'll toss my math hat into the ring.



Sources:
RODE Calc (http://rode.doddlercon.com/db/calc/index.php)
RODataZone (http://rodatazone.simgaming.net/mechanics/substats.php)
MATH (hopefully)

Atum
01-17-2009, 02:11 PM
Its pretty simple as far as i experienced it :
1 aspd for 4 agi
1 aspd for 10 dex
Nothing more.

Aspd : baseaspd of your class + (agi/4) + (dex/10) + aspd pot + aspd skill - weapon aspd penalty - shield aspd penalty

Aspd pot boni i know:
Concentration potion: +4 aspd
Awakening potion : +6 aspd
Berserk potion : +9 aspd

Aspd skills i know so far :
Two hand quicken : +7 aspd
Frenzy : +15 aspd

Shield aspd penalty i know so far :
Assassin : -6 aspd
Alchemist : -4 aspd
Rune Knight : -15 aspd

Toledo
01-17-2009, 02:24 PM
So... assassins and alchemists are more proficient with shields than knights?

Aghh curse you logic, stay away

Kr4t0s
01-17-2009, 02:30 PM
baseaspd of your class

Damn you unknown variables!
Yeah, didn't know about that at all. Thanks for clearing that up.

I dunno how to feel about the general dumbing-down of formulas. It's cool, easier to figure, better for stat allocation, probably easier to balance classes.... But part of me misses the complication of it all. Same part that likes to do the cross word and shit. Finding the absolute perfect build and all that....

Yoyo
01-17-2009, 03:08 PM
The 4 agi/1 aspd seems pretty accurate, I just tested a bit and every 5/6 agi I got 1 aspd, but at times I got 2 aspd for just 2 agi, so I think (agi/4) is pretty much right in the end .-.
And on a completely but not really unrelated note, I got 190 aspd as a champion pretty easily; 99 base agi/dex, fist weapon, no shield, Job 66, Pantie+Undershirt combo (No agi cards on either of them), Agi/Bless, Awakening pot and 2 Athletic Linen Gloves (+2 Agi, +1 Dex, +2 Agi from Kukre). With mace and the same equips I got 188, slower, but much more worth it, especially for a build with less than 20 STR (Not that I plan on using it, maybe as a shura though) =x

Jackie Chan
01-17-2009, 05:00 PM
20 Agi grants +5 ASPD, but 4 Agi for 1 ASPD isn't true.

When you add +3 Agi, you get 1 ASPD. After this, for three times you get 1 ASPD for every 5 Agi. After you get these three bonuses, you get 1 ASPD for the next 2 Agi.

My ASPD:

01+19 Agi: 147 ASPD
04+19 Agi: 148 ASPD
09+19 Agi: 149 ASPD
14+19 Agi: 150 ASPD
19+19 Agi: 151 ASPD
21+19 Agi: 152 ASPD

Atum
01-17-2009, 05:09 PM
Yea i noticed that, its really wierd and sometimes adding 1 agi point actually decreases your aspd by 1.
I wonder if that decreasing agi and this wierd agi><aspd behaviour is a bug with the statuswindow or intended.

Yralyn
01-17-2009, 05:43 PM
Mighty thanks on the ASPD posting :) So let me get this straight: it's possible for a 99+15 AGI, 60+10 DEX Assassin Cross with Bless, Increase AGI, Pantie[1], Undershirt[1], Green Shoes, 2 Kukre Brooches, +5 AGI food, +5 DEX food and Awakes to get 190 ASPD with Katars?

Wow.

Now, regarding damage formula, which is more accurate, the one in the first post or the one posted by Atum?

Leviant
01-17-2009, 05:53 PM
So... assassins and alchemists are more proficient with shields than knights?

Aghh curse you logic, stay away


I guess it can still be called RO, LOL

Yoyo
01-17-2009, 05:58 PM
Yarlyn, no, it's not possible to get 190 aspd on sinx like that .-.
My sinx has 95 base agi and 81 base dex, she has 182 aspd with katars and 185 with bless/agi. Adding foods and more agi things, I'd get around 187~8 I think, but you'd probably need 99 base dex coupled with 99 base agi to get 190.

Lucentos
01-17-2009, 06:00 PM
Mighty thanks on the ASPD posting :) So let me get this straight: it's possible for a 99+15 AGI, 60+10 DEX Assassin Cross with Bless, Increase AGI, Pantie[1], Undershirt[1], Green Shoes, 2 Kukre Brooches, +5 AGI food, +5 DEX food and Awakes to get 190 ASPD with Katars?

Wow.

Now, regarding damage formula, which is more accurate, the one in the first post or the one posted by Atum?
About damage formula - most likely the new one.

Mmm... What about base ASPD of Gunslinger weapons and what bonuses providing his skills, Berserk potion?

Dynamo
01-17-2009, 06:10 PM
Assassin ASPD post
Wait. Shields are giving a penalty of -6 to ASPD. Is this fixed or variable by shield/class?

EDIT: Answered in other post.

bluefox
01-18-2009, 09:53 AM
What about Doppel/Cecil cards, Gatling Fever, Last Stand and Impressive Riff?

Yralyn
01-19-2009, 03:02 PM
So... assassins and alchemists are more proficient with shields than knights?

Aghh curse you logic, stay away
I think the logic is that Assassins and Alchemists are limited to only light shields anyway, while the Knights and Crusaders are intended to use heavy shields. Was hoping that they'd actually make it more logical to have ASPD penalty via shield based on weight BUT as the formula for ASPD is extremely simplistic anyway, oh well might as well uncomplicate matters and stick to the max ASPD penalty of -6 for those who can only equip a Buckler at best, and -10 for those who have access to heavy shields.

DeGuillon
01-19-2009, 03:29 PM
So... assassins and alchemists are more proficient with shields than knights?

Aghh curse you logic, stay away
I think the logic is that Assassins and Alchemists are limited to only light shields anyway, while the Knights and Crusaders are intended to use heavy shields. Was hoping that they'd actually make it more logical to have ASPD penalty via shield based on weight BUT as the formula for ASPD is extremely simplistic anyway, oh well might as well uncomplicate matters and stick to the max ASPD penalty of -6 for those who can only equip a Buckler at best, and -10 for those who have access to heavy shields.
Wrong.
ALL classes have acess to Bradium Shield[1](5 def).
ALL classes have acess to Proxy Skin Fragment[1]/Diablos Manteau[1](garment 5 def).
ALL classes have acess to Dark Basilium[1](helm 5 def, merchs can wear bone helms, 7 def).
ALL classes have acess to Diablos Boots[1](4 def)
ALL classes have acess to Safety Ring.
Now the equips that knights and crusaders have that ALL other classes don't.
fin helm(2 def).
iron cain(1 def).
greaves[1](5 def).
shields[1](6 def).
legion plate[1](11 def, crusader only, again merchs can wear meteors, which are 10 def, on pair with knights top armor).
that's only 5 more def for knights and 6 more def for crusaders. lol Yeah light shields. You know what's funny? All this doesn't matter because def sucks in renewal.

Doddler
01-19-2009, 03:40 PM
What about Doppel/Cecil cards, Gatling Fever, Last Stand and Impressive Riff?

Flat increases. Doppel will give +10 aspd, cecil gives +5 aspd, gatling is bugged and only gives 1 aspd but I think its supposed to give 10 and last stand was giving me +15. Last stand is incredibly pro since my rifle gunslinger sits around 177 aspd, and 190 aspd with a lever action rifle is incredibly sexy (http://rojournal.doddlercon.com/mediafiles/gunslinger84.php) (video is from before damage formula or any of the crit changes though).

And def isn't really that bad. I mean right now its the difference between taking 800 damage a hit from monsters and taking 1s.

Dynamo
01-19-2009, 06:01 PM
So... assassins and alchemists are more proficient with shields than knights?

Aghh curse you logic, stay away
I think the logic is that Assassins and Alchemists are limited to only light shields anyway, while the Knights and Crusaders are intended to use heavy shields. Was hoping that they'd actually make it more logical to have ASPD penalty via shield based on weight BUT as the formula for ASPD is extremely simplistic anyway, oh well might as well uncomplicate matters and stick to the max ASPD penalty of -6 for those who can only equip a Buckler at best, and -10 for those who have access to heavy shields.

It would be ok, if heavy shield give 20 hard def and light gives 5. But I don't think that +2 def will be sufficient to pay 5 ASPD.

Jayed
01-19-2009, 07:06 PM
Shield aspd penalty i know so far :
Assassin : -6 aspd
Alchemist : -4 aspd
Rune Knight : -15 aspd
Dancer loses 5 aspd for having a shield

Yoyo
01-19-2009, 10:10 PM
I've been playing a crusader today, I came to some conclusions:

- Smite seems actually stronger than shield boomerang with a weapon. Having 99+7 STR and a +4 uncarded Cross Shield, I was dealing 897 with boom (Also, apparently every +1 adds a flat +10 damage to boom Lv.5, and that's with quite possibly the strongest shield for boom'ing) and Smite dealt about 950~1k+ damage using a +0 Tirfing (Boomerang is still not affected by weapon atk). With the same build and equips my Lv.10 Bash dealt around 2k, and even Lv.5 hit for 1,2~1,3k, on neutral stuff.

- Grand cross seems to be more influenced by STR rather than INT, and the damage overall seems a bit toned down, each hit was about 1,3~1,5k, with 87 base INT and 51 base STR and an uncarded +0 Pole Axe. It's still not affected by masteries, too.

- Shields reduce 5 aspd on crusaders.

- Spear Quicken now gives the same ASPD on all levels (It seems like it's not fixed though; it's giving me 8 ASPD now, while at some levels before I was getting 7). It also gives +3*SkillLV CRIT and +2*SkillLV FLEE. Also, Crusaders have faster aspd with 2h Spears than 1h Spears (Shieldless).

- I didn't notice the damage bonus for using Holy Cross with spears. The difference between a sword (Lv.1, 25 ATK) and a spear (Lv.1, 28 ATK) 1 base STR, both Spear and 1h Sword masteries at 10 and Lv.6 Holy Cross was about 10 damage (Which should be about simply the difference in ATK between both weapons).

I'd say that Spears are pretty much the only way to go for offense right now .-.

Lucentos
01-19-2009, 10:14 PM
I`m thinking that they should shift Gattling Fever and Last Stand ASPD(when GF will be fixed).

And Doddler - what amount of damage Gunslinger producing now with new formula? And what base ASPD his guns have?

Dynamo
01-19-2009, 11:16 PM
- I didn't notice the damage bonus for using Holy Cross with spears. The difference between a sword (Lv.1, 25 ATK) and a spear (Lv.1, 28 ATK) 1 base STR, both Spear and 1h Sword masteries at 10 and Lv.6 Holy Cross was about 10 damage (Which should be about simply the difference in ATK between both weapons).

The damage bonus is added only for 2-handed spears. Try it later, please.

Yoyo
01-19-2009, 11:47 PM
I need a 2h spear and 1h sword with the same ATK and level to test effectively though, suggestions? .-.

Edit; Ok, Hellfire and Tyrfing, both have 200 ATK and are Level 4 (The +3 STR from Hellfire would give it a very slightly higher damage). Both are +0, I have 93 status ATK and 15 Equip ATK (Not counting the weapons logically), and the Holy Cross is tested on a small monster and that doesn't have any resistance/weakness to Holy (Hornet), so that both weapons have the same reduction, and the SkillLV used is 7.

Tyrfing (93+215 ATK total) = 1318 Dmg
Hellfire (96+215 ATK total) = 2370 Dmg

The damage bonus seems VERY high, and given that it's only level 7 and already deals more damage than my level 10 Bash (1500~ish), HC seems like a really worthwhile skill now =x

Dynamo
01-20-2009, 12:07 AM
I need a 2h spear and 1h sword with the same ATK and level to test effectively though, suggestions? .-.
Gladius and Glaive. Turn off your Peco Peco and test Holy Cross in a medium monster, because both spears and daggers have the same damage penalty for that size when you're desmounted and both the masteries will give the same damage bonus.

Yoyo
01-20-2009, 12:26 AM
^
I just tested .-.

And WOW, I've got Lv.10 now, the damage at petites with my 41+9 Str, Bless, A +4 Zephyrus with 2 Scorpion King cards (Earth petites are undead now), I'm dealing upwards of 6k per holy cross >>"

Atum
01-20-2009, 05:01 AM
According to this site (http://future.sgv417.jp/index.php?%B4%DA%B9%F1%B9%F0%C3%CE) this weeks KRO renewal patch will implement the Warlock class :)
*cant wait*

So spear quicken lvl 10 gives 7~8 aspd, 30 crit and 20 flee now?
Sweet.
Crits with spear quicken and Ahlspiess (ignore all def) must be pretty hot now.

Zephyrus are 3 slotted by the way, the third slot is just not shown. A friend of me on iro iris has a triple saharic Zephyrus.

Flat increases. Doppel will give +10 aspd, cecil gives +5 aspd,
Are you sure cecil gives +5 aspd?
When i equipped 4 cecil cards with a spec jur they only gave me 2 aspd total.
Maybe bugged so they give only 0.5 aspd at the moment?

Don Norris
01-20-2009, 05:56 AM
Just some questions.Do you know TKM's base ASPD (bare-handed and with books)?
By the way, i've got a crazy idea. A combat/autocaster sort of build using Encyclopedia (it gives 70 matk if i remember well and it has some nice crit, by the way) and gazeti card and maybe even kasa could be good?

Bui
01-20-2009, 06:00 AM
The rate of the Gazeti and Kasa IMO is pretty bad.

raoniluna
01-20-2009, 06:50 AM
2 Questions that I hope someone can answer me:

1. Giant Encyclopdia still gives extra crit based on your base LUK? If yes its still 1 crit for each 5 luk?

2. Any change in Taekwon Master skills? The way it is now it seems pretty nerfed in renewal since there are penalties for killing low level monsters...

And please answer Don Norris question about ASPD too xD

Atum
01-20-2009, 07:11 AM
1. Giant Encyclopdia still gives extra crit based on your base LUK? If yes its still 1 crit for each 5 luk?

2. Any change in Taekwon Master skills? The way it is now it seems pretty nerfed in renewal since there are penalties for killing low level monsters...
As long as there is no patchnotice about skills or items being changed there is a very very high chance that they still remain the same as before.
So yes, giant Encyclopedia should still give 1 crit for 5 luk and i dont think TKMskills are lowdmg now,i saw TKMs doing 3~4k skills on earth petites if i remember correctly.

Why would you kill lower level monsters in renewal for leveling?
There are always good monsters to level on and in your range, regardless what class you are.

Don Norris
01-20-2009, 07:54 AM
Kasa card has 2% proc. rate, Gazeti C. has 10% proc. rate, but they would be an added bonus anyway. What i don't know is how much damage can do these spells, since i would be relying mostly on the matk given by the book. Well, we should see how much aspd get decreased on taekwons, anyway, since the whole matter is based on using the nice aspd of a combat taekwon for autocasting.

Barigas
01-20-2009, 07:55 AM
One more question: if you kill a low-level monster(Thara frog) when you are high level(99 lev Sniper) can you still get card from that mob?

Atum
01-20-2009, 08:41 AM
Yes, you will have a normal droprate when killing lower level monsters.
There is only a penalty for killing monsters that are way higher than you (you wont get any drops from these)

Teoc
01-20-2009, 08:47 AM
Someone asked about impressive riff

- OMFG ! Its incredible right now! Or at least its doing the same for melees that magic strings done for magic classes. my battle priest jumped from 176 to 190, and its beautiful *_*.

Of course, it was an agi bard, but even so impressive riff its definetly not an useless skill now.

And WITH strings the game dont look to far away from the current RO without strings, i saw an HW being able to cast SG one after another without leaving any "blank spaces"

Aldenn
01-20-2009, 08:51 AM
Wait, earth petite cards are anti-undead now and scorpion kings are anti-dragon? I should be happy hearing that it looks like scorpion kings would now be implemented, but switching the card effect with earth petite? What would happen to all the people who made earth petite weapons for abyss lake?

Atum
01-20-2009, 08:56 AM
No.
For some reason (probably to give priests on the renewal test server a good lvl 88+ monster until all maps are balanced out) earth petites are undead race now (instead of dragon race) you can healbomb and TU them (not sure if this is only for kro renewal or a permanent change).

Scorpion king cards do +20% dmg vs undead race, thats why they work agains the now-undeadrace petites ( the monster "scorpion king" is not implemented on kro renewal, we can buy the cards from an npc, i doubt gravity will implement scorpion king/scorpion king card with renewal for normal servers)

Earth petite card still is the same as ever (+20% dmg vs dragon race), no card effect was switched.

Michael Chandra
01-20-2009, 09:44 AM
Tyrfing (93+215 ATK total) = 1318 Dmg
Hellfire (96+215 ATK total) = 2370 Dmg
And WOW, I've got Lv.10 now, the damage at petites with my 41+9 Str, Bless, A +4 Zephyrus with 2 Scorpion King cards (Earth petites are undead now), I'm dealing upwards of 6k per holy cross >>"*Admiring whistle*

And now we wait for Warlock. =)

Yoyo
01-20-2009, 10:07 AM
Atum, I know Zephyrus has 3 slots, but I have to use one of those for Harword to get perfect (Or near-perfect) hit. And on the aspd-card topic, if Cecil card still increased 5 aspd, I'd figure that Harword would reduce 5 aspd, seeing as they have both the same % reduction/increase, but at times I don't even lose 1 aspd from Harword.

Doddler
01-20-2009, 11:24 AM
Guess I'm wrong about aspd, I'll write more on it later.

Aldenn
01-20-2009, 12:07 PM
It would be very funny if they really made earth petites undead even in main servers. Also, eagerly awaiting if the rumors are true that warlocks are next to be tested. I hope that aside from them, another 3rd job would be tested.

Atum
01-20-2009, 12:22 PM
It would be very funny if they really made earth petites undead even in main servers. Also, eagerly awaiting if the rumors are true that warlocks are next to be tested. I hope that aside from them, another 3rd job would be tested.
The official patch notice is already posted here
http://forums.irowiki.org/showthread.php?t=22035

Warlocks only with this weeks update.

Another thing : i think they changed ghost element somehow.
I dbed a baby leopard (ghost 1) and i couldnt hit it at all with a neutral weapon (on iro you can still hit them with 25% dmg) and element weapons, regardless which element, did only 25% dmg to them (while on iro you do 100% dmg to them with any element and ghost does bonusdmg to them).
Unfortunately i didnt have any ghost weapons with me and i didnt see any regular spawning baby leopards so far on renewal.

raoniluna
01-20-2009, 12:43 PM
1. Giant Encyclopdia still gives extra crit based on your base LUK? If yes its still 1 crit for each 5 luk?

2. Any change in Taekwon Master skills? The way it is now it seems pretty nerfed in renewal since there are penalties for killing low level monsters...
As long as there is no patchnotice about skills or items being changed there is a very very high chance that they still remain the same as before.
So yes, giant Encyclopedia should still give 1 crit for 5 luk and i dont think TKMskills are lowdmg now,i saw TKMs doing 3~4k skills on earth petites if i remember correctly.

Why would you kill lower level monsters in renewal for leveling?
There are always good monsters to level on and in your range, regardless what class you are.

I was talking about you having to choose a map or an enemy to use your skills, not about damage. Besides heat all damage skills are kicks from TK Kid and not TK Master amd I said TK Master skills were nerfed.

When choose one enemy (Hatred) you will only benefit from your skill for 10~20 levels, pretty useless IMO. When you choose a map (Feeling) it is not that different since mosnters levels are at the same range.

Doddler
01-20-2009, 02:29 PM
Another thing : i think they changed ghost element somehow.
I dbed a baby leopard (ghost 1) and i couldnt hit it at all with a neutral weapon (on iro you can still hit them with 25% dmg) and element weapons, regardless which element, did only 25% dmg to them (while on iro you do 100% dmg to them with any element and ghost does bonusdmg to them).
Unfortunately i didnt have any ghost weapons with me and i didnt see any regular spawning baby leopards so far on renewal.

Thats kind of strange... I was able to hurt most ghost element monsters without an elemental weapon at all, yesterday I was hunting nightmares on a gunslinger with regular bullets and while my damage sucked they did die. This should be because status attack power bypasses elemental modifiers.

Atum
01-20-2009, 02:31 PM
Hm, yea, my Biochem had only 1 str this could be why i totally missed with neutral weapon.:angel:
Still doesnt explain why other elements do only 25% dmg on ghost,though :confused:
(i tried hitting it with excalibur and fireblent and both did only ~30 dmg)
Ohwell, have to db another one and test more :D

Kr4t0s
01-20-2009, 03:11 PM
Another thing : i think they changed ghost element somehow.
I dbed a baby leopard (ghost 1) and i couldnt hit it at all with a neutral weapon (on iro you can still hit them with 25% dmg) and element weapons, regardless which element, did only 25% dmg to them (while on iro you do 100% dmg to them with any element and ghost does bonusdmg to them).
Unfortunately i didnt have any ghost weapons with me and i didnt see any regular spawning baby leopards so far on renewal.

Could be, guessing, that theyre ghost 4. That is how ghost 4 works, no damage from neutral, 25% from elements. When was the last time you sense'd it? May have changed.. or the sense on it may be bugged. I've had a few experiences of that on iRO. *shrug*


EDIT: FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

Doddler
01-20-2009, 03:15 PM
My gunslinger couldn't hit nightmares with silver bullets (well did the same damage as regular bullets). Maybe ghost element is broken?

Atum
01-20-2009, 03:35 PM
Could be, guessing, that theyre ghost 4. That is how ghost 4 works, no damage from neutral, 25% from elements. When was the last time you sense'd it? May have changed.. or the sense on it may be bugged. I've had a few experiences of that on iRO. *shrug*
Ghost4 still takes 100% dmg from the 4 natural elements,holy, dark and undead and not only 25%
http://irowiki.org/wiki/Ghost
So it seems like ghost element is broken or maybe its supposed to be like this to encourage the use of ghost property attacks, who knows...

Kr4t0s
01-20-2009, 04:25 PM
Could be, guessing, that theyre ghost 4. That is how ghost 4 works, no damage from neutral, 25% from elements. When was the last time you sense'd it? May have changed.. or the sense on it may be bugged. I've had a few experiences of that on iRO. *shrug*
Ghost4 still takes 100% dmg from the 4 natural elements,holy, dark and undead and not only 25%
http://irowiki.org/wiki/Ghost
So it seems like ghost element is broken or maybe its supposed to be like this to encourage the use of ghost property attacks, who knows...

SOURCE WARS!
http://iro.ragnarokonline.com/game/propertysystem.asp

EDIT: FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

Doddler
01-20-2009, 04:38 PM
Could be, guessing, that theyre ghost 4. That is how ghost 4 works, no damage from neutral, 25% from elements. When was the last time you sense'd it? May have changed.. or the sense on it may be bugged. I've had a few experiences of that on iRO. *shrug*
Ghost4 still takes 100% dmg from the 4 natural elements,holy, dark and undead and not only 25%
http://irowiki.org/wiki/Ghost
So it seems like ghost element is broken or maybe its supposed to be like this to encourage the use of ghost property attacks, who knows...

SOURCE WARS!
http://iro.ragnarokonline.com/game/propertysystem.asp

I think it says ghost deals 25% damage to those elements, not those elements do 25% damage to ghost.

Atum
01-20-2009, 04:45 PM
SOURCE WARS!
http://iro.ragnarokonline.com/game/propertysystem.asp
I quote from the site you linked :

How to read the attribute chartThe rows represent the monster's attribute, and columns are the attributes of the spell or skill. The side that is using an elemental attack doesn't have separate levels, but the side receiving damage is separated into 4 different levels.

Kr4t0s
01-20-2009, 04:59 PM
GOD DAMN IT! I'VE BEEN READING THAT THING WRONG FOR ALMOST 5 YEARS!! :mad:


Ironically, I only looked at it for ghost. I had most the other elements of interest memorized. And I never really encountered ghost much.

...still. GOD DAMN IT!



so yeah... guess its just broken..... :(

Jackie Chan
01-20-2009, 06:06 PM
Someone casts spells vs. a ghost element monster? Some RPGs have ghost targets who can only receive damage by magic sources.

Maybe Gravity is trying to do something like this.

paladinenvec2
01-20-2009, 07:29 PM
The spear quicken buff it's so nice xD +30 crit,+20 flee sounds like a win to me.

Sarune
01-20-2009, 07:38 PM
I wish kRO renewal would add zeny NPCs and up the exp rates a bit. I'm barely motivated to level anything there because it's so damn boring.

Anyway, Doddler are you going to change into a Warlock tomorrow?

Doddler
01-20-2009, 07:52 PM
I'm not sure if I want to trans or not first... I want to trans, but I'm actually down on cash on renewal since I transed my knight. I'd feel kind of cheap if I didn't see what a warlock changing from high wizard can do.

Frost
01-20-2009, 10:59 PM
But.. what CAN a high wizard do?

Mystical Amplification??.. that's about it. :(

Samias
01-20-2009, 11:16 PM
Gravity field was hugely buffed, and warlocks have insane skill prerequisites, so I'd imagine the extra 20 skill points would be very welcome considering how tight wizard points already are.

coolfish1103
01-20-2009, 11:42 PM
Warlock

Radius
- Level 3
- Increase Magic Range and Decrease Cast Time.
- Up to 3 cells and 8% reduction.

Spell Frozen
- Level 5
- For 30 seconds, char within range cannot use magic spells.

Recognized Spell
- Level 5
- For 60 seconds MATK will have not be floated, but increase 25% SP cost.
- Only max MATK will be applied.

Summon
- Level 5
- Summon Earth, Fire, Water or Wind Ball.
- Max 5 balls can be summoned, last 70 seconds. SP depletes as the ball remains. Explodes at MATK 300% when hit.

Tetravortex
- Level 5
- Require one of each elemental ball.
- MATK 900% x 4 (each attack is one element). 100% chance to inflict burnt, frozen, bleeding, or stun.

Release
- Level 2
- Use an elemental ball to destroy elemental balls summoned by target.

Drainlife
- Level 5
- MATK 500%, forced neutral element.
- 70% chance to recover hp from 30% of the damage dealt.

Marsh of Abyss
- Level 5
- Decrease move speed, agi, dex on a target.
- Max 30% decrease.

Sienna Execrate
- Level 5
- Stone Curse 7x7 area around the target.
- Success chance up to 70%.

Frost Misty
- Level 5
- 15x15 area attack, chance to frozen.
- Up to 70% chance to frozen, decrease def, move speed, attack speed, cast speed. Does not change to water element.

Jack Frost
- Level 5
- MATK 700%, water element.
- Deals damage to all targets in Frost Misty mode.

Chain Lightning
- Level 5
- Deals MATK 700%, wind element to a target.
- Chained 9 times, and will deal damage on areas near target.

Crimson Rock
- Level 5
- MATK 700%, fire element.
- Deals damage to target and areas around, will push back up to 4 cells, chance to stun.

Hell Inferno
- Level 5
- MATK 700%, fire element, chance to burn.
- Reduce MDEF and hp depletes over time.

Comet
- Level 5
- Require another Warlock next to the caster.
- 15x15 area attack, MATK ranged from 1600% (far) to 4000% (near), fire elemental, chance to burn.
- Reduce MDEF and hp depletes over time.

White Imprison
- Level 5
- Jail a character for a duration of time. In duration, all damage besides Ghost element deals no damage. When duration is done, depletes 2000 hp on caster.
- Success chance up to 90% and can be casted on caster itself.

Soul Expansion
- Level 5
- Ghost element, deals 2x the damage to character in White Imprison mode.

Information gathered from http://cat.time-loop.net/

paladinenvec2
01-21-2009, 12:04 AM
So warlocks are more like debuffers?

skidoosh
01-21-2009, 12:12 AM
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/7789/warlockcz4.png

Teoc
01-21-2009, 12:15 AM
Warlock



Tetravortex
- Level 5
- Require one of each elemental ball.
- MATK 900% x 4 (each attack is one element). 100% chance to inflict burnt, frozen, bleeding, or s


Drainlife
- Level 5
- MATK 500%, forced neutral element.
- 70% chance to recover hp from 30% of the damage dealt.


Sienna Execrate
- Level 5
- Stone Curse 7x7 area around the target.
- Success chance up to 70%.

Frost Misty
- Level 5
- 15x15 area attack, chance to frozen.
- Up to 70% chance to frozen, decrease def, move speed, attack speed, cast speed. Does not change to water element.

Jack Frost
- Level 5
- MATK 700%, water element.
- Deals damage to all targets in Frost Misty mode.


Comet
- Level 5
- Require another Warlock next to the caster.
- 15x15 area attack, MATK ranged from 1600% (far) to 4000% (near), fire elemental, chance to burn.
- Reduce MDEF and hp depletes over time.

White Imprison
- Level 5
- Jail a character for a duration of time. In duration, all damage besides Ghost element deals no damage. When duration is done, depletes 2000 hp on caster.
- Success chance up to 90% and can be casted on caster itself.


Information gathered from http://cat.time-loop.net/

Just the most importabt IMO.

its not like a debuffer, its more like they chain spells now. Dont know if it is the "multi warlock" spell...but its nice. The guy can summon an ghostring around himself, can summon one BFComet...and that water skill probably its a pain in the ass.

But Tetra Vortex dont seem so strong after all....but we have to see it.

bluefox
01-21-2009, 12:37 AM
So I can summon elemental balls now?
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/6097/scrm116rx.jpg
I can finally pretend I'm using Orreries Sun!

Ryock
01-21-2009, 12:38 AM
Summon a ghostring around himself? You're giving the skill too little credit. No damage from any attack except ghost type? I'd love to see a Gfist do absolutely nothing to me. Though, it seems kinda overpowered... I'm wondering if the person inside the imprison can still use skills or cast? Probably not.

We stole a spell from Marisa! =D

Neece
01-21-2009, 12:44 AM
I don't even have a Wizard, but I came with their skills. The lack of the Poison element made me sad, though. Gravity lied to us =p
But, damn, those are NEAT. Recognized Spell + Amplify will make warlocks a force to be reconed with. Spell Frozen will nulify that pesky sorcerer that keeps harassing you. Tetravortex will kick the s**t out of anything that dares to get too near to become a targer (renewal Mdef, a 900% hit hurts like hell. Imagine four!). Drainlife alows you to solo without fear of runing out of HP (specially if element modifiers aply, just like GF). Marsh of Abyss... well, it's just quagmire over again, ain't it? Maybe it's an skill simprovement, like you use it and it works like that + the lvl you know of quag. Sienna Execrate is just ouch. As if Stone Curse wasn't a pain XD. Frost Misty is the kind of area control we should have seen since wizies came out. Jack Frost, with it's most likely 700% one-huge-area-hit (the entire area of Frost Misty, if I get it right) can easyly output SG usefullness on WoE (who gets frozen - not the new stat - nowadays, anyway?). Chain Lightning made me think. If you have 9 monsters on the same cell (or within a 2x2 square, nothing too hard in a game where two monsters CAN ocupy the same cell), you can efectively deal 9*700%, 6300% wind damage to a group of monsters?!?! (adjacent enemy damage). If so, I fear for new water-based dungeons. Even in WoE, if nor wearing wind armor, this can deal some damage to enemy forces. Crimson Rock, if the stun chance is high, is a finisher in WoE, where stun=death(i think it is still like this in renewal...). Hell Inferno might be usefull for the burn status effect. Comet, if single-hitting, can most probably kill a lot of classes with a clean hit. Maybe any class, with Lex. An Frenzied RK might survive, though... White Imprison is sure interesting, as it can remove any unsavoring enemy from the fight at any given moment. But probably renders the Warlock useless during the spell (except for Soul Expansion), being dangerous to use during the war. Soul Expansion, if with a great damage, might force people to think twice before using elemental armor again.

Am I the only one that saw the raw damage of these skills (except Comet and Tetra Vortex) is WAY lower than older ones'? I think the new Mdef formula (direct reduction) made that don't matter that much, since their 1-hit format would make them hurt a LOT more. And a 90% chance that their cast times and delays are waaay smaller, too.

Can't wait to see them in action ^^

Jackie Chan
01-21-2009, 12:44 AM
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/7789/warlockcz4.png

You're beautiful :lv:

I think Warlocks wasn't made by the same devs who made Rune Knights and Archbishops.

They have powerful skills, powerful counters against these skills and nice combos, like Sienna Execrate + Comet and White Imprison + Soul Expansion on enemies.

Nice design, one of the bests i've see in this game until now.

Nyarlathotep
01-21-2009, 01:01 AM
Summon a ghostring around himself? You're giving the skill too little credit. No damage from any attack except ghost type? I'd love to see a Gfist do absolutely nothing to me. Though, it seems kinda overpowered... I'm wondering if the person inside the imprison can still use skills or cast? Probably not.

We stole a spell from Marisa! =D
Lets hope they dont make an asura skill (for the shura class) with ghost element... :stir:

paladinenvec2
01-21-2009, 01:04 AM
Just the most importabt IMO.

its not like a debuffer, its more like they chain spells now. Dont know if it is the "multi warlock" spell...but its nice. The guy can summon an ghostring around himself, can summon one BFComet...and that water skill probably its a pain in the ass.

But Tetra Vortex dont seem so strong after all....but we have to see it.

Well they sure are like a debuff, stat giver's while dealing mid-heavy damage, i think that they will be pretty versatile in combat , most of the skills seem to be a really pain in the ass, area stats,imprision,stat debuffs ,etc.

Frost
01-21-2009, 01:06 AM
Wow! Too bad all of these skills will probably be easily countered by ME(Land Protector), sucked up by magic rod, or just spell broken :P.

paladinenvec2
01-21-2009, 01:13 AM
Wow! Too bad all of these skills will probably be easily countered by ME(Land Protector), sucked up by magic rod, or just spell broken :P.
Well yeah but if the sage class get's under the effects of "spell frozen" first , this ones will get a hard time.

Ryock
01-21-2009, 01:18 AM
Wow! Too bad all of these skills will probably be easily countered by ME(Land Protector), sucked up by magic rod, or just spell broken :P.

Well, obviously XD. It's no different from how it is now, and we still get plenty of aoe spells off. Plus there's always Ganbantein for the High Wizards who changed, and Spell Frozen.

Kr4t0s
01-21-2009, 01:21 AM
Hahahaha
RO -> WarCraft III

White Imprison -> Banish
Chain Lightning -> Chain Lightning

...


But yeah, honestly, I think WCIII has brilliant skill direction, and I welcome RO getting more like them in that respect.

Correct me if I'm wrong. ..Frost Misty is just going to further, as Doddler put it, the SG game..?

These things sound great. Honestly, they better have shitty cast times. If Tetra isnt ATLEAST 5 seconds, if not 10.. thats just bull....


Plus there's always Ganbantein.

Ha ha, you so funny.

Doddler
01-21-2009, 01:29 AM
http://forums.irowiki.org/showpost.php?p=352985&postcount=1

I put the full skill descriptions in the topic. I haven't added SP cost of skills, I know Comet takes 2000 SP at level 5 though! Most skills are more in normal range though. I'll update that page and the wiki later.

Frost
01-21-2009, 01:30 AM
Stasis just sounds too good to be true. We'll have to see its actual cast time / delay / chance / or how to remove it else warlock battles will be just about who casts stasis first .

Bishops have area dispell, Warlocks have area stone curse, A Prevent magic casting spell (I think this should be a sorcerer's spell, oh well..)

Makes me wonder what sorcerers' spells would be.

paladinenvec2
01-21-2009, 01:39 AM
Question:
Frost Misty
Max Lv: 5
Prereq: Summon Water Ball 1
Description: Covers a 15x15 area in a freezing mist, causing damage and inflicting [Freezing] status to targets that enter. Targets caught with [Freezing] status have their defense, attack speed and movement speed lowered, and take longer to cast spells.
[Level 1] : 30% chance to cause freezing status
[Level 2] : 40% chance to cause freezing status
[Level 3] : 50% chance to cause freezing status
[Level 4] : 60% chance to cause freezing status
[Level 5] : 70% chance to cause freezing status

so theorically, freezing it's not the same as frozen status, so marc won't work?

Kr4t0s
01-21-2009, 01:47 AM
They sound interesting. They're quite strong, but they strain themselves. Putting their HP and SP on the line to be a force to be reckoned with. They get a skill stopper, a divest, a magic crit (old style crit), elemental spirits spheres, hp steal, and cripple moves... crossing lines of classes. Bold move.. looks cool.

Suprised they didn't try to save napalm Vulcan with WI.

Frost
01-21-2009, 01:52 AM
They get a skill stopper,

Well, not actually a skill stopper. Silence stops you from casting skills. But Stasis only stops you from casting magic spells. And yes, the game can differentiate magic from normal attack skills (take GTB for example).

BTW, Warlocks have 50 job levels (49 points) opposed to needing 100 points to invest in full level in all spells.

To all wizards out there, if you haven't learned to use /bm, now is the time to do it :P.

paladinenvec2
01-21-2009, 02:09 AM
They get a skill stopper,

Well, not actually a skill stopper. Silence stops you from casting skills. But Stasis only stops you from casting magic spells. And yes, the game can differentiate magic from normal attack skills (take GTB for example).

BTW, Warlocks have 50 job levels (49 points) opposed to needing 100 points to invest in full level in all spells.

To all wizards out there, if you haven't learned to use /bm, now is the time to do it :P.
The main difference here must be that silence i'ts not much of a problem, just use green potion,panacea or RJ, Stasis seem to created only specifically to counter another magic class and my guess it's that they won't be affected by normal restorative items or skills.

Probably the intention of gravity it's to create different types of warlocks that's why they get so many skills, lame that RK got the short end of the stick in versatility of the skills.

Toledo
01-21-2009, 02:21 AM
So I can summon elemental balls now?
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/6097/scrm116rx.jpg
I can finally pretend I'm using Orreries Sun!

Ninja class : Naruto :: Warlock class : Touhou

I hope 3rd classes will not arrive in my lifetime...

Lucentos
01-21-2009, 02:32 AM
Stasis and White Imprison sounds intimidating and even can be imbalanced, especially with Radius. Ranged classes aka Hunter Branch and Gunslinger losing their only advantage of being untouchable by less ranged attacks while recieving nearly nothing to increase selfprotection at least from other classes`s ranget threats.

Toledo
01-21-2009, 02:54 AM
I would be worried more about Recognized Spell + Comet. That's 4000% mATK and Burn.

White Imprision sounds very much like Stone Curse, so I figure it will have similiar limitations(hopefully).

But man, if they will continue to pump out powerful classes like that, RO will turn into a 13-year-old kid's high rate pserver where everyone kills everyone else with one hit and there's not much thought involved.

Barigas
01-21-2009, 04:47 AM
Wizard was meant to be really strong damage class. But now evil druid card + potions+ 40+ mdef completely killed this class. And i think that Warlock's will have more chances in battle than High Wiz has now.

Phaust
01-21-2009, 05:01 AM
Stasis and White Imprison sounds intimidating and even can be imbalanced, especially with Radius. Ranged classes aka Hunter Branch and Gunslinger losing their only advantage of being untouchable by less ranged attacks while recieving nearly nothing to increase selfprotection at least from other classes`s ranget threats.


Remember that Marsh of AByss reduces 30% of agi/dex.I think this would be more threat that Imprison.

Michael Chandra
01-21-2009, 05:09 AM
I would be worried more about Recognized Spell + Comet. That's 4000% mATK and Burn.I think the 1600%~4000% is related to your distance of the center of the Comet. So if you're not near the center you still take less damage, it just means maximal mATK. 2000 SP sounds heavy by the way, you're going to love having over 4k max sp and soul exhale around if you want to use that puppy.

Frost
01-21-2009, 05:23 AM
Stasis and White Imprison sounds intimidating and even can be imbalanced, especially with Radius. Ranged classes aka Hunter Branch and Gunslinger losing their only advantage of being untouchable by less ranged attacks while recieving nearly nothing to increase selfprotection at least from other classes`s ranget threats.


Remember that Marsh of AByss reduces 30% of agi/dex.I think this would be more threat that Imprison.

On players it reduces only half so it's only -15% agi/dex. Quagmire is more powerful if you ask me -50% agi/dex for a maximum of 50 agi/dex reduced. Quagmire is also AoE but unfortunately screws up your allies. However, Marsh is a single target so it will probably have it uses.

Dishonru
01-21-2009, 07:14 AM
On players it reduces only half so it's only -15% agi/dex. Quagmire is more powerful if you ask me -50% agi/dex for a maximum of 50 agi/dex reduced. Quagmire is also AoE but unfortunately screws up your allies. However, Marsh is a single target so it will probably have it uses.Quagmire reduces at max 25/25 on players. It used to reduce a full 50%, too bad they don't cap it at 30-50.

Guru Clef
01-21-2009, 07:21 AM
I don't if someone posted this before.

But the NPCs of the training field don't give you base levels anymory. After all of the conversations, you just receive 5% o base xp. I think that's because the new xp table.

You can become a first class in lv 3 base. Because the novice xp table for job, I think was not changed:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v499/vini/Ragnarok%20R/screen_R000.jpg

And the new damage of Fire Ball still more weak than Fire Bolt. Maybe still not a good skill to spend your points. I just compare the lv 5 damage of the two skills.

I started to play Ragnarok R today. I will try to get some more important informations too.

RazorBlazE
01-21-2009, 08:05 AM
Comet + Amp = full screen Magic asura?

Atum
01-21-2009, 08:56 AM
Tetravortex sounds really nice if you are not sure what element the enemy has.Just cast it on him and youre pretty much guaranteed that you will do 100% dmg with all elements (incase he is normal/ghost) or one element will be reduced but another element will deal 175~200% damage.

On normal element and ghost targets this spell will do as much damage as a level 36 bolt (900%x4 = 3600% dmg) :)
I wonder if a lex aterna doubles all the Vortexhits and if all hits will be affected by Magic amp.

The ball skills and release together sound like a magical TSS with elements.

I wonder how lightning chain work if there are only 2 Targets in the area.
Will the lightning jump back and forth between these 2 targets until all 9 hits will be dealt?

Only thing i dont like is that we have to decide between the, in my opinion, best skills : Tetra Vortex and Recognized spell. Damnit :(

Doddler
01-21-2009, 09:11 AM
On players it reduces only half so it's only -15% agi/dex. Quagmire is more powerful if you ask me -50% agi/dex for a maximum of 50 agi/dex reduced. Quagmire is also AoE but unfortunately screws up your allies. However, Marsh is a single target so it will probably have it uses.

The best option of course is to use both in combination with frost mist. :devil:

Frost
01-21-2009, 09:26 AM
On players it reduces only half so it's only -15% agi/dex. Quagmire is more powerful if you ask me -50% agi/dex for a maximum of 50 agi/dex reduced. Quagmire is also AoE but unfortunately screws up your allies. However, Marsh is a single target so it will probably have it uses.Quagmire reduces at max 25/25 on players. It used to reduce a full 50%, too bad they don't cap it at 30-50.

Oh sorry :) It was quite some time ago since I've checked on quagmire reductions.

Doddler
01-21-2009, 09:28 AM
http://www.ragnagate.net/zboard/data/screen4/250/111111111.JPG
http://www.ragnagate.net/zboard/data/screen4/250/222222222.JPG

Crimson Rock appears to be the new current favorite. Judging by her matk and the damage its doing, its hitting for 700% per hit of the skill, and it hits 4-5 times. :o

What you can see in the second screenshot though is that while the cooldown on crimson rock is not very long, there is a skill specific delay. This is probably likely for most warlock (and 3rd job) skills. Guess if its reasonable there may still be a use for meteor storm afterall.

Leviant
01-21-2009, 09:28 AM
what i'm curious about is if you can have 5 balls of each element and use release lvl 2 :devil:


damn skill tree

thunder_euRO
01-21-2009, 09:30 AM
I'm disappointed with current warlock. It was told by gravity that wl will get some speels that needs more or two wl to cast. I see only one, comet. Second is that grav said wl will get new element spells, e.g. anti ghost / poison ele skill. Don't see them. So imo wl is a buffed hwiz with one combo skill, some new debuffs / stat effect casts and the ability to drain life.

I hoped that summon tree is like summon in WoW. But that is okay. In future every cls will have his own bullets flying around them, everytime 5 ea... Boring.

Tetra Vortex can be a spell for foru warlocks. Every wl casts one element and foru together can cast tetra vortex.

Hmm, I'll try warlock if I have enough time. Sprite isn't nice, but okay. Doesn't look like an magic class to me.

Doddler
01-21-2009, 09:36 AM
The animated sprite is much better I think than the original concept. And their new element skills, while not quite as expansive as they were saying, aren't bad. A 500% matk neutral spell is a big boost (though I'm going to guess this was going to be the poison element skill). The summon skills are interesting, From the sounds of things they play a lot like sight blaster, meleeing a warlock with them up is going to hurt you.

Dynamo
01-21-2009, 09:40 AM
Why don't Warlocks have shadow element magic and a few curses?

:confused:

Sometimes I feel that Gravity miss the concept of the classes.

Pain~
01-21-2009, 09:46 AM
Too many skills for the few points Q_Q Good I got two highwizards, so I can go both ways... Have to make my 2nd one 99 before it hits our servers. But that should be np at all.

Leviant
01-21-2009, 09:49 AM
Why don't Warlocks have shadow element magic and a few curses?

:confused:

Sometimes I feel that Gravity miss the concept of the classes.

RO Logic


hm... yeah, though of course, its still to early, but yeah... its Gravity

Gio
01-21-2009, 09:59 AM
as much as i'd love to use shadow magic, every game has its own world, and its own rules, i don't see you saying the same thing for Blizzard, i dont see logical at all that Mage class doesn't have any lightening spells in WoW, for example.

Leviant
01-21-2009, 10:10 AM
hm....self White Imprison in.... WOE-SE

Atum
01-21-2009, 10:14 AM
Are these screens with or without magic amplification?:D

Self-white imprison, if you can still cast spells, will be very hot to protect yourself against stupid skills like earthquake and hells judgement.
Also,you could continue precasting while others fail to kill/interrupt you since you wont take any damage.

hokage-24
01-21-2009, 10:17 AM
as much as i'd love to use shadow magic, every game has its own world, and its own rules, i don't see you saying the same thing for Blizzard, i dont see logical at all that Mage class doesn't have any lightening spells in WoW, for example.

It's not about rules, it's about balance, without the inclusion of shadow spells warlocks won't be able to fight efficiently holy property monsters and such.

Frost
01-21-2009, 10:25 AM
Why don't Warlocks have shadow element magic and a few curses?

:confused:

Sometimes I feel that Gravity miss the concept of the classes.

Well, Gravity's concept of Holy spells belongs to aco/priest/crusader classes. Poison belongs to thief/assassins.

Mage/wizard/warlocks is Magic with Earth, Fire, Wind, Water and Heart. Go Captain Planet! Ghost property making them strong against almost every element in the game. Their weaknesses were holy and shadow type monsters, but now since warlocks have a neutral property spell, their weakness is now gone.

Jackie Chan
01-21-2009, 10:36 AM
Warlocks are efficient against all other property monsters. I think this is balance.

I think the undead and dark spells are represented by skills like Marsh of Abyss, Drain Life, Frozen Misty, etc. Curse spells are represented by stone curses and Napalm Vulcan.

And, lol, job concept? WHO CARES?

Dynamo
01-21-2009, 11:43 AM
Warlocks are efficient against all other property monsters. I think this is balance.

I think the undead and dark spells are represented by skills like Marsh of Abyss, Drain Life, Frozen Misty, etc. Curse spells are represented by stone curses and Napalm Vulcan.

And, lol, job concept? WHO CARES?
Well, if they want a different concept, pick other name for the class. Otherwise RO will be like Tibia, where the class named Paladin has Archer powers.

Doddler
01-21-2009, 11:47 AM
Warlock doesn't convey anything to me other than a powerful magic user...

paladinenvec2
01-21-2009, 12:02 PM
I'm disappointed with current warlock. It was told by gravity that wl will get some speels that needs more or two wl to cast. I see only one, comet. Second is that grav said wl will get new element spells, e.g. anti ghost / poison ele skill. Don't see them. So imo wl is a buffed hwiz with one combo skill, some new debuffs / stat effect casts and the ability to drain life.

I hoped that summon tree is like summon in WoW. But that is okay. In future every cls will have his own bullets flying around them, everytime 5 ea... Boring.

Tetra Vortex can be a spell for foru warlocks. Every wl casts one element and foru together can cast tetra vortex.

Hmm, I'll try warlock if I have enough time. Sprite isn't nice, but okay. Doesn't look like an magic class to me.
I have to disagree, it's true that gravity said "many" things but like politicians many ideas get the axe, even blizzard with his big budget didn't match the expectatives about WOTLK,but that's another history, before the official release warlock description seemed dump to me,anyway the information wasn't reliable at that time, you can't believe prealpha-build comentaries from developers, coz they can change teir opinion really quick.(shadow,poison,ghost spells sound kind of meh,power of the elements ftw), but now i can see that they're pretty cool, the change it's pretty noticeable, in fact the buffed wizz it's really the high wizz, warlock are more like an annoying class that can give to your enemies many stats at the same time and deal insane damage.
For me they are far more interesting than RK's:yawn:.

Phaust
01-21-2009, 12:16 PM
Im more happy with WL because it finally has a decent Earth spell.

Jackie Chan
01-21-2009, 12:25 PM
Warlock doesn't convey anything to me other than a powerful magic user...

I agree.

@Dynamo

Wierd Warlock concept? Wierd DARK concept?

So, you think holy and dark spells can only be represented only by an "element" on the skill description? It's only a wrond word. I think the appropriate word is _property_.

Any angel or demon can cast a fireball. This fireball have holy/dark properties, thanks to nature of caster, but fire element remains.

Holy and dark element are so stupid as heart element, lol. I say, Warlocks haven't dark element spells, but have dark properties on many skills, like Hellfire for example.

Warlocks have a decent concept. The concepts in RO considered as wierds are just abstracts concepts, don't need to have definitions like some MMOs, just because they're pop.

Dishonru
01-21-2009, 12:43 PM
Warlocks are what I had hoped for.

Dynamo
01-21-2009, 12:54 PM
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Warlock_(DnD_Class)
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Warlock_(D20_Modern_Advanced_Class)#Background

D&D is the father of all RPGs and the Warlock class was never seen before it was released in a D&D supplement. The class was a complete success and since this it started appearing in general games.

Jackie Chan
01-21-2009, 01:33 PM
D&D no matters. The object of this discussion is the concept of dark spells, not related with the engine of any game.

Toledo
01-21-2009, 01:37 PM
Weren't warlocks originally just male version of witches? Making "female Warlock" quite a faux pas oh my!

Oddly enough, it's topic of newest PA (http://www.penny-arcade.com/images/2009/20090121.jpg).

I guess it could be worse, they could be called Very High Wizards.

Kr4t0s
01-21-2009, 03:04 PM
I guess it could be worse, they could be called Very High Wizards.

Friend of mine thought they should be called Super High Wizards.



One thing that I can say for sure.. I cant wait to see what ...bleh.. sorcerers.. can come up with to counter warlocks.

(I hate the name sorcerer, feels lame and generic... mage, sage, scholar/professor, sorcerer..... whats next? Magic Caster.. Hopefully they'll get a name change when they come to iRO....... but this all is whining for another time.)


Seriously though, these are cool skills, so I hope they get great counters.

Sethram
01-21-2009, 08:27 PM
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Warlock_(DnD_Class) (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Warlock_%28DnD_Class%29)
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Warlock_(D20_Modern_Advanced_Class)#Background (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Warlock_%28D20_Modern_Advanced_Class%29#Background )

D&D is the father of all RPGs and the Warlock class was never seen before it was released in a D&D supplement. The class was a complete success and since this it started appearing in general games.

In DnD Kobolds are lizard like folks with draconic blood but here they are little puppy dog type things and in Wow they are rats. DnD is indeed a moot point in this arguement.

skidoosh
01-21-2009, 08:38 PM
Quick little update, I LOVE Warlock! So strong.
http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/5237/updateif0.jpg
I'll be making my renewal post soon :)

Extasy
01-21-2009, 09:20 PM
whats the common/top matk after renewal?

Jayed
01-21-2009, 09:38 PM
Warlock doesn't convey anything to me other than a powerful magic user...
Warlock is the male counterpart of a witch. Are witches good?

Yoyo
01-21-2009, 10:20 PM
Actually, witch is the female counterpart of wizard (Only not on D&D, I guess!) .-.

Frost
01-21-2009, 10:42 PM
Witch, Warlock, Wizard, Mage, Sorcerer, Enchanter, Enchantress, Magus, Harry Potter, Gandalf, etc. So many confusing names @_@

Jayed
01-21-2009, 10:46 PM
Actually, witch is the female counterpart of wizard
Maybe in harry potter books...

paladinenvec2
01-21-2009, 10:56 PM
I really don't think that "what this class should be named" discussion will get to anywhere, many ppl have differente references, RPG's, books ,mitology,etc, it's pointless, it's like to disccus "what was first? the chicken or the egg?".

Yoyo
01-22-2009, 12:15 AM
Well uhm, I never read a single Harry Potter book, let alone in english, I just picked those from wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wizard_(fantasy) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wizard_%28fantasy%29)), as it refers to them as "Witch or Wizard", which I think implies 2 genders for the same thing .-.

Anyhoo, I can't log into renewal server right now, as it says my EXE is not the most up to date one? Even though my client is fully patched and I even tried not using a hexed EXE? >>"

Edit; Apparently everyone got this error just now, I managed to get to the server select window, 2 people on .-.

Doddler
01-22-2009, 12:58 AM
Sakray R went down for temporary maintenance, the patch notes are as follows:

- Corrected a server instability issue.
- Corrected an issue where the Warlock summon series skills (Fire Ball / Water Ball / Ball Lightening / Stone) allowed you to summon 5 times with just level 1.
- Changed Rune Knight rune stones to fail when used on other character classes.
- Crimson Rock, Jack Frost, and Soul Expansion have had their damage corrected.
- Fixed incorrect skill icons used for some warlock skills.

thunder_euRO
01-22-2009, 01:38 AM
hmm. Runes could be used with other classes, in past. Sounds nice. But now it's fixed. Can't wait to see skill animation of warlock. Hope tonight I'll reach warlock.

Gio
01-22-2009, 02:38 AM
Any screens or info after the damage being corrected thing?

kasperlcd
01-22-2009, 01:03 PM
Scholar

Soul Exhale
* The amount of SP transferable with Soul Exhale has changed. Now you cannot give a target more than 50% of their max SP with the skill.


whhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhy

as if ppl dont bitch enough about sp, they decided to makes a scholars job even more tedious

and instead of changing dispell to not be so crippling they chose this?
i hate renewal it makes me qq

Barigas
01-22-2009, 02:12 PM
I agree with you, I thing that Dispell should be fixed (maybe chance depending on int(like Strip depends on dex)). But maybe cast time nerf may change anything... So what is about warlocks' skills cooldowns, base cast time and range? What char is able to do in White Imprison(use skills, attack)? What range it has? How long it last? How it could be cancelled (dispell, backslide, body relocation, evil druid card)?

Pred
01-22-2009, 02:16 PM
When I first saw the description for the new Soul Exhale I was under the impression that 2 Soul Exhales will give someone all their SP back (assuming you had the SP to give, of course).

Is this true? or can you only give sp via Soul Exhale if they're under 50%?

Let's say you have 1283901283901 sp, and your target has 25 out of 100 sp left. Would Soul Exhaling your target get him to 50/100? or 75/100? I did a search for Exhale in the renewal section and it hasn't been specified which it is.

Toledo
01-22-2009, 02:41 PM
I am assuming it gives the target 50% AT MOST. You know, to make SP actually a viable game resource again.

Realus
01-22-2009, 03:06 PM
Would Soul Exhaling your target get him to 50/100? or 75/100?
I doubt they changed how soul exhale (Besides the nerf) works in the Renewal.

But currently, you trade SP with them. Any overflow (from either character) is ignored.
Scholar (1200/1200 sp) trading with wizard (2400/2400 sp); You end up with
Scholar (1200/1200 sp), and Wizard (1200/2400 sp)
[actually, one of them would have 1195 because of soul exhale's 5 sp cost] [I think it was the scholar.

Hence 1int scholars have a hard time giving wizards/priests sp. And some MVP champs.
We can't use it twice to bring them to full.

Pred
01-22-2009, 03:52 PM
Wow, I've been out of RO too long -_- *facepalm* completely forgot how exhale works, thanks

skidoosh
01-22-2009, 05:24 PM
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/6527/trashyi5.jpg
(New Crimson Rock)

Yoyo
01-22-2009, 05:27 PM
I actually think that they broke the spells now, instead of fixing. Right now they seem like Spiral was some time ago: One hit damage, divided by five.

Gio
01-22-2009, 07:45 PM
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/6527/trashyi5.jpg
(New Crimson Rock)

1580 total Damage?, isn't that kind of... weak? xD...

Frost
01-22-2009, 08:09 PM
Please Don't tell me that they're fixing Crimson Rock to deal 700% total damage :(.

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/6527/trashyi5.jpg
(New Crimson Rock)

:(

Gio
01-22-2009, 08:12 PM
I guess that once they see this joke, they'll fix it xDD. Seems weaker than Firebolt to me xDDD.

Yoyo
01-22-2009, 08:27 PM
I still say they broke crimson rock by making it one hit damage, especially seen that coincidentally, spiral is bugged the same way again.

Atum
01-22-2009, 09:16 PM
I still say they broke crimson rock by making it one hit damage, especially seen that coincidentally, spiral is bugged the same way again.
Spiral works fine, just tested it.

vjallerdyce
01-25-2009, 08:43 AM
the way i see it, the developers are unjustly NEGLECTING the sage job class... now, warlocks are overpowerful, judging by their ability to do max damage with max MATK, and their devastating area of effect spells... not to mention their ability to reduce their casting time...

and so, if i may suggest, they must focus on giving the SORCERER class some neat and versatile skills too... perhaps making them more battle oriented...

and whatever happened to "sages are master of the elements"? maybe they thought, "hey, let's give all the good stuff to the warlock class... who cares about sages?"

i have nothing against wizards... in fact, i used to be a wizard until the sage class came in... i thought it would be a much more exciting experience seeing as how they can cast spells while walking and attacking and how they can spell break other magic users...

but now, i think i'm going to waste all the effort i've put into my sage and start anew... as a wizard...

way to make my dreams come true, gravity corp. (sarcasm implied)

ponggie
01-25-2009, 08:45 AM
can somebody post RK vs WL in pvp, photos or vid anyone plsssss

Wanderer
01-25-2009, 10:53 AM
can somebody post RK vs WL in pvp, photos or vid anyone plsssss

so people can start whining about who is worse?

Jackie Chan
01-25-2009, 11:42 AM
Ok, Asura can kill a RK, AB or WL, even casted by a simple Monk.

Discussions about GvG/PvP don't help us yet, just wait for the other 3rds Jobs and a renewal system definition.

GvG/PvP environment isn't clear right now.

bluefox
01-25-2009, 12:04 PM
Maybe Sorcerers are going to have a skill that dispels everyone who's playing.

Atum
01-25-2009, 12:09 PM
Maybe Sorcerers are going to have a skill that dispels everyone who's playing.
A similar skill to soul exhale but for exchanging hp would be kinda cruel in duels :D

Pa.rabola
01-25-2009, 02:02 PM
the way i see it, the developers are unjustly NEGLECTING the sage job class... now, warlocks are overpowerful, judging by their ability to do max damage with max MATK, and their devastating area of effect spells... not to mention their ability to reduce their casting time...

and so, if i may suggest, they must focus on giving the SORCERER class some neat and versatile skills too... perhaps making them more battle oriented...

and whatever happened to "sages are master of the elements"? maybe they thought, "hey, let's give all the good stuff to the warlock class... who cares about sages?"

i have nothing against wizards... in fact, i used to be a wizard until the sage class came in... i thought it would be a much more exciting experience seeing as how they can cast spells while walking and attacking and how they can spell break other magic users...

but now, i think i'm going to waste all the effort i've put into my sage and start anew... as a wizard...

way to make my dreams come true, gravity corp. (sarcasm implied)

You think the Sage class will be useless now? Fixed cast times means easier spell breaks. ME will still be a vital skill. (and etc..)

Not to mention, the third class for a Sage doesn't even have sprites yet, much less any skills announced. Hold off your emo until you can judge the class properly. The assumptions in the post are ridiculous.

Michael Chandra
01-25-2009, 03:24 PM
Gods forbid a third class would have any advantages over a different second class.

DeGuillon
01-25-2009, 04:28 PM
Ok, Asura can kill a RK, AB or WL, even casted by a simple Monk.

Discussions about GvG/PvP don't help us yet, just wait for the other 3rds Jobs and a renewal system definition.

GvG/PvP environment isn't clear right now.
Sorry to disapoint you, millenium shield > asura from any champ,
safety wall > asura from any champ, white imprison/safety wall > asura from any champ.

@warlock being more powerfull than sages
Wizards are the owners of powerfull spells while sages make use of various skills to strenghtenen other skills and weaken their targets.
I don't know why you are discussing this now, it has ALWAYS been this way.

Torchd
01-26-2009, 02:47 AM
Noob question:
I got a KRO account, but I don't kwon where to click to play renewal <.<
(Yes, I have KRO and KRO Sakray fully updated D: )

btw, I don't think asura can kill one lvl 100+ Arc with tons of vit and good gears.

Arthur
01-26-2009, 03:22 AM
You need the renewal client RagexeRE. It's on their site

Atum
01-26-2009, 03:43 AM
Noob question:
I got a KRO account, but I don't kwon where to click to play renewal <.<
(Yes, I have KRO and KRO Sakray fully updated D: )
Download the renewal client from the kro site.
The button for starting the game after patching is the same as on iro and the normal kro clients.

btw, I don't think asura can kill one lvl 100+ Arc with tons of vit and good gears.
Dont forget while ABs can get more hp by getting 120 vit and lvl 150 asura-shuras could also get 120 basestr/120 baseint and more sp with the increased int/base 150 so they should still onehitkill nearly every class.

I wonder if they gonna add a 4th aspd potion for maybe lvl 120+.
We have concpot for lvl 1-40, awake for 40-85 and berserk for 85+ and several classes got their aspd lowered.

Frost
01-26-2009, 06:11 AM
Might be a stupid question but.. Can you level higher than lv 99 if you haven't changed into 3rd classes? What about expanded classes? Can they go beyond lv 99?

Lucentos
01-26-2009, 06:30 AM
The future of Expanded classes is unclear to us. But I`m sure that we will se something for them.

Beetleking
01-26-2009, 06:33 AM
Might be a stupid question but.. Can you level higher than lv 99 if you haven't changed into 3rd classes? What about expanded classes? Can they go beyond lv 99?


If you change the 3rd class you can get 150lvl max, and expanded class can get 99lvl max.

Decoy949
01-26-2009, 08:43 AM
Do they still have the stupid lvl 99 base level requirement to switch to thirds? Just seems like they should have stayed purely with job level, since after all you're only changing your job.

Pa.rabola
01-26-2009, 11:31 AM
Well, you need a requirement somewhere. And since it isn't apparently job 50/70 as we thought..

Renewal makes job levels (including nontrans 2nd class) closer to the 9x category, as opposed to hitting max job at 7x-8x today.

Torchd
01-26-2009, 11:38 AM
http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/9324/screenr012gq5.jpg
This mean no more DS spaming (?) and no more shining plants here ;_;

Frost
01-26-2009, 11:49 AM
WTF!?!? How much is the delay :( ? If it's something like 0.3 seconds, it's bearable. So does this mean hunters are nerfed.. YET AGAIN??

Yoyo
01-26-2009, 11:59 AM
It's still very well spammable, even as a Gypsy with 74 base agi and about less than 170 aspd, and even with a huge lag (I say that from personal experience, just got her to 99 a few days ago by levelling purely with DS spam)

Doddler
01-26-2009, 12:02 PM
I know a lot of skills are going to need delays added. With the inability to perfect resist stun (or even get anything remotely close to 50%-70% resist) or drop the duration time of stun below 2s or so basically requires dazzler to have a delay. Other skills it seems are likely to come under adjustment too.

I knew DS always had a short delay on kRO, though I'm not sure how much, or if its been adjusted with renewal.

Torchd
01-26-2009, 12:07 PM
Maybe more agi, faster spamming, like normal DS.
But I still feel it slower D:
Anyway, I'll be ready to taste ranger.

schi
01-26-2009, 03:20 PM
I know a lot of skills are going to need delays added. With the inability to perfect resist stun (or even get anything remotely close to 50%-70% resist) or drop the duration time of stun below 2s or so basically requires dazzler to have a delay. Other skills it seems are likely to come under adjustment too.

I knew DS always had a short delay on kRO, though I'm not sure how much, or if its been adjusted with renewal.

valk armor + dark basilium + stalactic golem combo not working anymore for 100% (98%) stun resist?

Doddler
01-26-2009, 03:57 PM
You could probably wear status resist gear like that and do alright, thats true, I haven't tested those. Even with 100 vit and 100 luck though, you're still stunning more than you'd usually want.

Barigas
01-27-2009, 01:48 AM
How much hp white potion recovers in renewal? Is there any cooldown on using recovering items?

Atum
01-27-2009, 01:54 AM
There is no cooldown for recovery items.

thunder_euRO
01-27-2009, 02:24 AM
First I thought there was a little delay for using pots but after some time I noticed that my connection (from germany, europe) is very laggy.

I'm confused about enterinh high level dungeons, e.g. nameless island, thanatos tower, biolabs, etc.

If I don't mistake I need the quests to enter, do I? I ask myself how to do the quests, especially the nameless quest.

Has someone done quests in Renewal, yet? If yes, do quests give the same exp as in regular RO servers? Are the quest NPCs implemented in Renewal? I've only grinded, yet.

BTW: Casting time is poor, even with around 120 int and 100 dex. I can get a cup of coffee while I'm casting SG. But the dmg output is incomparable strong than actual RO servers.

I like the buffed mage skills, e.g. fireball and storm gust. At present I wouldn't skill fireball but with renewal it is nice mass dmg skill in mid range levels. Also in renewal I don't need Meteor Storm anymore. Perhaps in WoE but no more for grinding.

It is mostly a lot of fun. I saw a lot "new" playces with my mage and wizard but I could stay only for a few levels at location. My idea is that every monster that is above my level should give exp if I can kill it. But the maximum bonus must be locked to 50% (10 levels above). That would make leveling easier ;)

Beetleking
01-27-2009, 06:39 AM
http://img301.imageshack.us/my.php?image=crimsonrockds9.gif crimson rock animated.

Beetleking
01-27-2009, 11:20 AM
http://ktqyra.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p5HfdbKOZPGWWzKI-B3IUB3MN39UaeQh9ZJ4W3SCgh7bel7kvJu6ayA2M66f2cg3eLd CuW8qVhGu_Nko_iQDuGw/screen_R073.jpg

Frost misty attack.

Yoyo
01-27-2009, 12:20 PM
That's just a lot of ice walls and the actual Frost Misty (The blue mist around the warlock) is dealing damage to them .-.

Barigas
01-27-2009, 04:23 PM
Can someone help me with Renewal? I have kRO account and full-patched sakray.exe(I was able to login with my kRO account and create novice and play with sakray.exe). But when I run Ragnarok_RE.exe I get an error "Load MapInfoTable Failed!". I'm downloading Ragnarok090121.zip from the main site now.Do you think it can help me?

Atum
01-27-2009, 06:46 PM
For technical problems/errors please use the Tech support forum (http://forums.irowiki.org/forumdisplay.php?f=36)
I'd say redownload your mainclient and renewal client (you dont need the sakray client), reinstall mainclient,let mainclient patch,install renewal client and let renewal client patch.
You can find downloadlinks for mainclient/renewal client on the kro homepage.

Rumm
01-27-2009, 09:35 PM
the way i see it, the developers are unjustly NEGLECTING the sage job class... now, warlocks are overpowerful, judging by their ability to do max damage with max MATK, and their devastating area of effect spells... not to mention their ability to reduce their casting time...

and so, if i may suggest, they must focus on giving the SORCERER class some neat and versatile skills too... perhaps making them more battle oriented...

and whatever happened to "sages are master of the elements"? maybe they thought, "hey, let's give all the good stuff to the warlock class... who cares about sages?"

i have nothing against wizards... in fact, i used to be a wizard until the sage class came in... i thought it would be a much more exciting experience seeing as how they can cast spells while walking and attacking and how they can spell break other magic users...

but now, i think i'm going to waste all the effort i've put into my sage and start anew... as a wizard...

way to make my dreams come true, gravity corp. (sarcasm implied)

You think the Sage class will be useless now? Fixed cast times means easier spell breaks. ME will still be a vital skill. (and etc..)

Not to mention, the third class for a Sage doesn't even have sprites yet, much less any skills announced. Hold off your emo until you can judge the class properly. The assumptions in the post are ridiculous.

while i dont agree with vjall...since we have no idea what sorc's gonna be like... para u forget spell breaker has cast time also. So does ME. But otherwise i agree, hold off on emo'n out. Tho i think i will emo out if i lose my fox!

Frost
01-28-2009, 12:06 AM
Spell breaker has 0.7 sec cast time. With renewal reductions, It would be somewhat 0.3 seconds. Faster than any average spell with a cast time.

Gio
01-28-2009, 09:43 AM
is server down?

Arthur
01-28-2009, 10:42 AM
Nope, 176 players online

Yoyo
01-28-2009, 04:49 PM
So, I made a ninja, and kunai it seems REALLY buggy;
-It doesn't count weapon atk or weapon upgrades, only equip atk (Zipper counts as equip)
-It's fixed neutral, no matter what weapon or kunai I use.
It's pretty good though, with a quad zipper mg, 99 base str and bsb/porcellio, I do about 4,7k nevermiss damage on all monsters .-.

Also, I found out something: +% Cards increase both WEAPON Atk and EQUIP Atk. Here's some tests I did (The target is hornet):

WITH BSB/PORCELLIO:
Barehanded: 3717 Damage
Uncarded Murasame: 3717 Damage
Double Insecticide Murasame: 3987 Damage

WITHOUT BSB/PORCELLIO:
Barehanded: 3042 Damage
Uncarded Murasame: 3042 Damage
Double Insecticide Murasame: 3042 Damage

^ Notice how the damage did increase with % cards and equip atk from bsb/porcellio, but didn't increase without any equip atk.
Plus, each equip ATK seems to give +9 damage to Throw Kunai, and each status ATK, +19 damage. I don't know where kunai ATK goes in the formula, but since they all have the same ATK and the skill is unusable without one, it's kinda neglectable .-.

Frost
01-28-2009, 07:00 PM
Maybe it's because of how it's coded before renewal too. pre-renewal, it didn't increase damage based on weapon atk (with the exception of ice pick). Only BSB, Porcellio, Andre/Zipper, +xx atk increasing cards increased the damage. Post renewal, +% cards now effect all of weapons and equip atk. But the skill was coded to ignore weapon atk. So there's your outcome :/ .

Yoyo
01-28-2009, 07:58 PM
Well, not on the beginning of renewal it wasn't. I remember well a screenshot of a ninja hitting like 6~7k with one kunai on a high orc, and that could be either because:
A) Weapon ATK wasn't toned down yet;
B) Elementals
Plus, there weren't any notices about kunai being like this (I can kinda understand the "wATK doesn't count" part, but why would they make it fixed neutral, with no influence from elements at all, if all kunais are exactly the same, only differing in element?), so there's got to be something wrong there >>'

raoniluna
01-29-2009, 07:05 AM
Ok, now I'm happily playing renewal woot
Would somebody help me with making money? .o?
Im already level 62/50 Taekwon Kid and have only 20k
Leveling is pretty fast but no money for me =/

And about critical, it seems like it is not 1.5x, or it is 1.5x of status attack, don't know
I was doing 212 normal hit and 296 crit. If the monster had 0 def I was supposed to do 318 damage right? But I suppose Orc Warriors have more than 0 def...

Atum
01-29-2009, 08:36 PM
Ok, now I'm happily playing renewal woot
Would somebody help me with making money? .o?
Im already level 62/50 Taekwon Kid and have only 20k
Leveling is pretty fast but no money for me =/
Hardly anyone has money :D
Rebirthing is expensive on a server without market.
You could try to go to Tyo factory and kill Myst cases, dont know their level though, but they should drop piece of cake very often.
But i can give you some money too,whats your char?

And about critical, it seems like it is not 1.5x, or it is 1.5x of status attack, don't know
I was doing 212 normal hit and 296 crit. If the monster had 0 def I was supposed to do 318 damage right? But I suppose Orc Warriors have more than 0 def...
Your normal hit : 100% dmg - def
Your crithit : its not (100% dmg - def)*1.5 but (100% dmg*1.5) - def

It is kinda hard to calculate the damge on paper now since we dont really know the new armordef of the monsters, the sense-window only shows the statusdef.

Kr4t0s
01-30-2009, 01:57 AM
And about critical, it seems like it is not 1.5x, or it is 1.5x of status attack, don't know
I was doing 212 normal hit and 296 crit. If the monster had 0 def I was supposed to do 318 damage right? But I suppose Orc Warriors have more than 0 def...Your normal hit : 100% dmg - def
Your crithit : its not (100% dmg - def)*1.5 but (100% dmg*1.5) - def

It is kinda hard to calculate the damge on paper now since we dont really know the new armordef of the monsters, the sense-window only shows the statusdef.

Actually, I think she's right. Based off her numbers...
Y is modded. X is any constants
Y - X = 212
Y*1.5 - X = 296
Subtracting the two formulas yields:
-0.5 * Y = -84
and Y = 168

Seeing as how the modded damage is less the normal hit damage; this would suggest, as she says, that crit is modding only a portion of the formula. Again, solving for X shows that it is negative (that it adds more damage), that means that X isnt just the def, its other parts of the atk formula and the def.... but yeah.... So crit isn't, at least according to this one instance of math, as good as it was once believed.

I am sure that Atum and Doddler are to now prove me wrong with their "experience in renewal" pfft. :p

thunder_euRO
01-30-2009, 02:06 AM
It's not only the missing market that is annoying. It's the grinding at 0815 level places as well. Or doing quests to enter high level dungeons, e.g. nameless, abyss lake or thanatos. How to test such dungeons if you can't do the quests because of missing items, parties, etc.?

Also you can't level like at current servers because you don't have all the money you need for items. Partyplay?! Virtually impossible.

Gravity should remove all quests to enter such dungeons, etc. Should sell headgears, etc.

I think it's a testing server for the new game mechanics. But at the moment you're very limited.

raoniluna
01-30-2009, 02:56 AM
Hardly anyone has money :D
Rebirthing is expensive on a server without market.
You could try to go to Tyo factory and kill Myst cases, dont know their level though, but they should drop piece of cake very often.
But i can give you some money too,whats your char?

Your normal hit : 100% dmg - def
Your crithit : its not (100% dmg - def)*1.5 but (100% dmg*1.5) - def

It is kinda hard to calculate the damge on paper now since we dont really know the new armordef of the monsters, the sense-window only shows the statusdef.

About the money, thanks a lot but I think I can survive =D
If I run out money and my children feel hungry I will ask you to save the day xD

About the critical, I was considering your formula and that's the problem with the formula ou said the critical should be even higher than the first one. But both formula fails x_x"

At drillers I was doing 254 normal and 354 critical it makes no sense at all .o

Edit: I mistakenly job changed my taekwon into a Soul Linker and now I will have to remake the character u.u

But it doesnt matter their rates are very high in a few hour I get to lvl 80 o.o

Is it 10x?

Lucentos
01-30-2009, 03:17 AM
About Crit - you can just test it in the PvP enviroment due to full knowledje about target`s TTC.

Frost
01-30-2009, 03:56 AM
At drillers I was doing 254 normal and 354 critical it makes no sense at all .o


x = your damage, y = monster defense.

x - y = 254
(x*1.5) - y = 354

figure it out and you'll have
x = 200
y = -54

Thus the driller had negative defense!

.. huh??
:confused:

One thing. What was your level and what was the driller's level? Was it bonus damage because of being higher level? Are you sure that 254 and 354 are the correct numbers?

Atum
01-30-2009, 04:16 AM
I'm not really sure about the crit formula, i'm just using formulas i got from jro future wiki, we should really test crit in pvp.
Is it 10x?
The server should be 5~10x XP rate but even on a 1x XP server it should be no problem to get lvl 99 (trans) :)

Michael Chandra
01-30-2009, 05:51 AM
Don't forget damage variation.

Maybe partying up for quests is easier if you're, say, Korean and have guildmates and a kRO Renewal forum to prepare such things. =P

raoniluna
01-30-2009, 08:30 AM
I was barehand as a Taekwon so my hits are always the same damage.
Later I could have screenshots, I remade my character and just reached lvl 65 now I could try drillers again...

You PvP supreme masters could try damage dare, I wouldn't dare to enter such a fearsome palace of bloody thirsty warriors

Doddler
01-30-2009, 01:02 PM
http://rojournal.doddlercon.com/mediafiles/highmage.html

CamStudio sucks pretty bad at recording that dungeon. Pretty short video playing as a low level high mage. Intestingly enough playing mage seems pretty fast casting, compared to most wizard skills. Its a shame lots of the mage skills don't scale well to content later.

boncer
01-30-2009, 02:00 PM
fraps>all

Doddler
01-30-2009, 02:07 PM
I can't record fraps at a decent speed without using 1/2 screensize meaning you can't read equipment/stats etc, and I require to restart RO to get it to work. Anyways you can see what you need to in that vid.

Kr4t0s
01-30-2009, 04:14 PM
At drillers I was doing 254 normal and 354 critical it makes no sense at all .o


x = your damage, y = monster defense.

x - y = 254
(x*1.5) - y = 354

figure it out and you'll have
x = 200
y = -54

Thus the driller had negative defense!

.. huh??
:confused:

As I said in my post...

Again, solving for X shows that it is negative (that it adds more damage), that means that X isnt just the def, its other parts of the atk formula and the def....

So X isnt just the def. Its some part of the attack formula that isnt being modded + the def.

To recalc for these numbers...
Y = the part of attack that is modded.
X = the part of the attack that isnt.
Z = monster's def

Y + X - Z = 254
1.5*Y + X - Z = 354

subtract the two formulas...

-0.5 * Y = -100
Y = 200

This means that (X - Z) = 54
This shows that X > Z (by 54) and that since def >= 0, X is > 0. That means that some of the attack formula is not being modded.

Algebra's fun guys! :D

Gio
01-30-2009, 07:28 PM
I was doing Siromas Today (Wiz lv.89 'till lv.97), and i was surprised with new LoV. In Current RO, LoV deals less damage than Jupitel Thunder to any target there is in the game. Howevere, in renewal, my current Jt isn't capable of One-shoting Siromas (i'm dealing around 7.6K damage max), while my current LoV One-shots Siromas even with minimun damage.

stats are lv.97, 99+22Int, 91+8Dex, and 22+8Luk, holding a Hill wind carded Survivor's rod. This results in a (234 + 120) Matk.

-----

some screenies. (I dont have any video-thingy program)

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/9613/screenr054be7.jpg

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/8779/screenr064wj0.jpg

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/4729/screenr065ay9.jpg

Frost
01-30-2009, 08:16 PM
I remember reading somewhere that they increased LoV / SG / MS damage.

Atum
01-31-2009, 12:43 AM
Sorry for this big picture but i did some tests with acidbomb and i am quite pleased with the results (earthendow+BGweapon+AB = ouchie against unfrozen windarmors :D)
Also, biochems can at least use an immaterial sword now when facing Ghostring users so the weapon damage gets amplified a little.

EDIT: Added some screens about Acid Terror and Bomb.

Please forgive me for using the translated client (forgot to switch to original for taking screens) but there is no way i'm recollecting all the bombstuff on renewal and do all the tests over again, i hate collecting bombstuff and wasting it on non-mvps :angel: (no,please dont ask me about getting kro clients)

Acid Terror and Bomb:
http://forums.irowiki.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=1331&stc=1&d=1233386415

Note : Similar to fire pillar i couldnt throw bomb directly under an enemy, i had to put it on a free cell and drag the enemy to the bombfire.
I hope this gets fixed.
The bombfire had a nice "aspd", though, maybe double or triple the speed as in current RO :)
(you can see the speed of hits anyway on the screen with hurricane fury)


Acid Bomb
http://forums.irowiki.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=1330&stc=1&d=1233384455

Neece
01-31-2009, 01:37 AM
Atum, there is only one other test you could make, that is with a Bazerald for weapon/equip Matk. Acording to skill changes, AD is now afected by ATQ, MATQ, enemy VIT and MDEF. Once you get more ingredients, if possible, could you test those variables? I don't have and don't know how to make a proper alche/creator, so I can't test it =/

Atum
01-31-2009, 03:27 AM
99+2 str and 74+2 int with bazerald (+100 MATK) did
22800 vs Permeter
27750 vs Solider (fire does 175% dmg vs earth and solider has slightly higher vit i think).
Remember : the monsters i attacked were higher than i am (6-8 levels higher) so there is a chance that my damage was reduced by a certain percentage and the damage would go up when i reach their level.

I dont really plan on testing this skill def/mdef since with the new def/mdef formula def/mdef should hardly affect your damage (since armor def/mdef isnt reduced by a percentage anymore but a direct value, like status def/mdef) and i'll rather wait with more AB tests until 3rd class for alchemist is released since there could be so many changes until then and all i really wanted to test so far is if element/weapon/cards affect AB now.

If they buffed AB the same way they did with clashing spiral unendowed AB should do slightly more damage

Aldenn
01-31-2009, 06:30 AM
from what I can understand from your pictures, it seems that str is a much better stat now for maximizing acid demonstration damage compared to int, since the skill is now affected by cards and elements. Also, just by using a high atk weapon, you were able to boost your damage by a huge amount.

Atum
01-31-2009, 06:56 AM
from what I can understand from your pictures, it seems that str is a much better stat now for maximizing acid demonstration damage compared to int, since the skill is now affected by cards and elements. Also, just by using a high atk weapon, you were able to boost your damage by a huge amount.
The atk gained from stats like str is not affected by element or cards.
Only the atk gained from weapons and equipment atk is affected by % cards and elements.

I think Str and int are kinda equally good in doing damage for acidbomb, when i was using Naght siegers twin blade the damagevariance was kinda high, about 3~4k.
I have to test this theory (str and int equal?) a bit more later,though.

Frost
01-31-2009, 07:56 AM
Maybe.. Just maybe.. str based atk is reduced by def and int based atk is reduced by mdef? ..

Atum
01-31-2009, 08:05 AM
Yea,should be something like this, its also the same with Soul destroyer.
Mostly all physical skills work the same way now as far as i experienced it (str part reduced by def, int part,if it exists, reduced by mdef, element and % cards affects equip/weaponatk only, element bonus applies even if the skill is a neutral skill but still misses on ghost monsters)

Its also the same with Rapid smiting :
Forced neutral, affected by str, weaponpart is affected by element advantage and % cards and still misses on ghost, but when attacking non-ghost monsters you can use good elements to increase the dmg.

Sarune
01-31-2009, 08:24 AM
I can't record fraps at a decent speed without using 1/2 screensize meaning you can't read equipment/stats etc, and I require to restart RO to get it to work. Anyways you can see what you need to in that vid.

Use AmaRecCo, it's an amazing recording program and it's free. The quality is very good and it's not heavy on your computer resources as Fraps is. I can run two RO clients and I don't even lag!

http://amamaman.hp.infoseek.co.jp For the Japanese version.
http://amamaman.hp.infoseek.co.jp/english/top_e.html For the English version.

niektory
01-31-2009, 09:17 AM
Could you tell me what settings are you using? Because I can't get it to work better than Fraps.

Barigas
01-31-2009, 10:02 AM
So what is about Poem of Bragi(Magic Strings)... Does it reduce cooldown? Or it reduces both cooldown and variable cast time?

Turim
01-31-2009, 10:33 AM
I'm felling very depressive about these AB screen shots. Wasn't Renewal supposed to balance the game?

Atum
01-31-2009, 10:43 AM
So what is about Poem of Bragi(Magic Strings)... Does it reduce cooldown? Or it reduces both cooldown and variable cast time?
Should still reduce both, reduceable casttime and aftercastdelay.
I'm felling very depressive about these AB screen shots. Wasn't Renewal supposed to balance the game?
I dont really see whats wrong with Acidbomb.
We dont know how much vit the turtles have so its hard to say if this is the max damage we could expect or just a medium damage.

Also, dont forget i used very expensive weapons for this (Naght sieger twin blade and hurricane fury) and a part of acid bombs casttime is now fixed too, so no real spamming in magic strings or instantcat anymore, like in current RO.
I'd say the basedamage is lower than in the current RO (about half the damage or less), its the weapons that make it look that strong again.

Turim
01-31-2009, 11:30 AM
Well, EDP + SB was considered overpower in current RO and then in renewal they destroyed it. Became useless. But even in current RO, SB + EDP are no match for AB. So why they keep it so strong? You say the weapon is the reason, but the same isn't possible with SB.

I have a friend that was very happy with the possibility of finally have a chance to win a MVP against Acid Bombs with his future RK. But by the look of things even a 3rd class like Rune Knight isn't gonna be a match for them.

And sorry if something in my posts don't make any sense. I'm actually very bad at english.

Doddler
01-31-2009, 11:54 AM
Don't forget that acid bomb is also reducible by defense and resistance. Monsters in general have pretty low defense compared to players at the moment in renewal.

Atum
01-31-2009, 12:18 PM
Well, EDP + SB was considered overpower in current RO and then in renewal they destroyed it. Became useless. But even in current RO, SB + EDP are no match for AB. So why they keep it so strong? You say the weapon is the reason, but the same isn't possible with SB.
Uhm, i dont think so.
Acidbomb costs way more to use and in current RO EDP+Link+SB is way stronger than acidbomb (200k+ damage with a single sonicblow without meginjards), also, i dont think how it is on bRo, but on iRo nearly all worthwhile MVPs got their vit lowered to 25~30, making biochems hardly worth using on MVPs (unless you like to spend 1m zeny to get a dropped elu) and many future MVPs have pathetic vit (1~25) or are ghost element.
Also,acidbomb is much less spammable in renewal (~0.5sec fixed casttime i think)

RuneKnights shouldnt have that many problems competing with biochemists, they have a lot of runebuffs and high damage skills that can do a lot of damage (many are currently bugged,though, like Hundred Spear, which probably will do 20k~25k damage without endows if they fix it the same way they fixed Spiral).

On renewal there are no MVPs implemented yet, ill test the damage against MVPs as soon as possible but until then we shouldnt jump to any conclusion that Acidbomb is overpowered against MVPs :)

Lucentos
01-31-2009, 01:08 PM
I`m more than sure that all MvP will be instanced ones after Renewal.

Naida
01-31-2009, 02:37 PM
I`m more than sure that all MvP will be instanced ones after Renewal.

I hope they don't ALL require a party like for bapho >;(

Yuki Nagato
01-31-2009, 04:50 PM
Can someone clarify and would try out if 3rd job class can wear equipments like Valk Armor[1], Tidal Shoes[1], Wool Scarf [1], Vesper Cores, and other only Transcendent equip. Example. Can a Warlock equip a lich bone wand[2]

Thank you in advance

Since it is stated can only equipped by 2-1 or 2-2 Transcendent Class.

Yoyo
01-31-2009, 04:56 PM
Yes they can, even if said 3rd class character turned from non-trans 2-2 or 2-1

Gio
01-31-2009, 05:24 PM
How do i change from Wizard lv.99 to Warlock?, (I'll most likely not go rebirth since i dont have the 1.2M, and ... my time is short lately... exams... and stuff... o_o)

Yoyo
01-31-2009, 05:58 PM
As far as I remember, you use the job changer and you have to be at 0 weight, but again, it's been like a month since I changed my knight to rune, maybe it's different or I don't remember it D:

Atum
01-31-2009, 08:00 PM
You just go to the job changer at the top right in pront.
You dont have to have 0 weight and you can keep your stuff equipped, however you have to be base99 and you have to have all your skillpoints spent.

Yoyo
01-31-2009, 09:28 PM
Oh, right. I think I had 0 weight when I tried to change to RK when someone said you could turn 3rd at 95. Didn't work D:

Cidcho
01-31-2009, 09:55 PM
i am curios about class 3:

Are Transcendent Class who change to job 3 lost his trans skill like Battle chant or soul destroyer?

and how much job lv max for class 3 is 50 or 70 ?

Andry
01-31-2009, 10:00 PM
i am curios about class 3:

Are Transcendent Class who change to job 3 lost his trans skill like Battle chant or soul destroyer?

and how much job lv max for class 3 is 50 or 70 ?

no you can check this :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMBvE-avblE

the AB still can use assumptio.....check the buff list

(@skidoosh: sry I took your videos for example :D)

max job lv is 50

yea7777777
02-01-2009, 04:16 AM
what will happen to underrated skills of gunslinger like magical bullet, cracker, coin fling and others that i failed to mention..? and what is the new damage formula of gunslinger mine and spread shot? im planning to prepare my skills and stats for the renewal cause in pRO, i doubt they wont implement that stat reset thingy.. advance thanks for the answers.. =)

Aldenn
02-01-2009, 07:00 AM
Don't forget that acid bomb is also reducible by defense and resistance. Monsters in general have pretty low defense compared to players at the moment in renewal.

So acid bomb is a skill that has monster def into its damage equation, yet with renewal, is reducable by def and resistance. So, what would happen if say you use it on a high def and mdef target? Do you think it would even be possible that a target has such a high def and mdef that AB damage would become laughable?:confused:

Atum
02-01-2009, 07:03 AM
So acid bomb is a skill that has monster def into its damage equation, yet with renewal, is reducable by def and resistance. So, what would happen if say you use it on a high def and mdef target? Do you think it would even be possible that a target has such a high def and mdef that AB damage would become laughable?:confused:
Could be possible, however we dont know the real formula for the new acidbomb yet so its hard to say how much def/mdef/reduction you would need to reduce it to a survivable/laughable damage.
However 3rd classes with level 150 have a lot more hp compared to current classes so acidbomb shouldnt be that mass-killing anymore in woe/pvp.

TeaRs
02-01-2009, 07:52 AM
Since AD is reducable by def/mdef. Does weapons such as ice pick, combat knife or mdef piercing related boost/affect the damage in anyway?

Tea
02-01-2009, 04:32 PM
I'd guess only the physical (weapon) part, if at all.

Cidcho
02-01-2009, 09:06 PM
Forget to add to my question: is critical still ignore flee?

Striding
02-01-2009, 09:42 PM
Forget to add to my question: is critical still ignore flee?
sure

BTW, a question to who reseted their chars on the SakrayR:
what the conditions i need to have to make a reset? and what option? cause the only thing i done right was to make a list on a notepad about the job change list

Atum
02-01-2009, 10:11 PM
Since AD is reducable by def/mdef. Does weapons such as ice pick, combat knife or mdef piercing related boost/affect the damage in anyway?
As Tea said and after some tests with hitting sleepers with hurricane icepick and a fortune sword (both 90 atk) i believe that icepick effect (and probably all other weapons with def piercing or amplified damage depending on def) only affects the weapon/equip atk, while leaving the statusatk alone.
On most monsters you are better off using high atk-carded weapons, only class that i can think of light now that could really benefit from icepick is assassins using a high atk weapon in the mainhand and icepick in the offhand.

@Cidcho : yes, crits still ignore flee, however if you plan on killing way higher monsters (that you couldnt kill otherwise cuz you wouldnt hit them) : monsters with way higher level than you get a huge bonus on their critshield.
However if you only attack monsters in your range (up to 5 levels higher than you) you will have the normal critamount.

@Striging:check here
http://ro.thisisafuntime.com/
Guide for renewal
1st option, 2nd option = skillreset
2nd option, 2nd option = statreset
You have to have 0 weight, spent all skillpoints and have no cart/peco/ferus/falcon.

-eXcalibur-
02-01-2009, 11:25 PM
hi can i ask about Rune knight skills. about the hundread spear. and can anyone post a vidoe of rune knight skills? please?

Atum
02-01-2009, 11:59 PM
hi can i ask about Rune knight skills. about the hundread spear. and can anyone post a vidoe of rune knight skills? please?
Hundred spear has a really ear-hurting-loud and annoying sound and is currently bugged, it does hardly any damage (only 5~7k for 3~5 sec casttime, should be 25~35k damage when its fixed)
I will do some pics and tests as soon as its fixed.

For a video of runeknights using skills use doddlers journal
http://rojournal.doddlercon.com/index.php?cat=7
Scroll down a bit and you will find a video.

Striding
02-02-2009, 02:29 AM
Since AD is reducable by def/mdef. Does weapons such as ice pick, combat knife or mdef piercing related boost/affect the damage in anyway?
As Tea said and after some tests with hitting sleepers with hurricane icepick and a fortune sword (both 90 atk) i believe that icepick effect (and probably all other weapons with def piercing or amplified damage depending on def) only affects the weapon/equip atk, while leaving the statusatk alone.
On most monsters you are better off using high atk-carded weapons, only class that i can think of light now that could really benefit from icepick is assassins using a high atk weapon in the mainhand and icepick in the offhand.

@Cidcho : yes, crits still ignore flee, however if you plan on killing way higher monsters (that you couldnt kill otherwise cuz you wouldnt hit them) : monsters with way higher level than you get a huge bonus on their critshield.
However if you only attack monsters in your range (up to 5 levels higher than you) you will have the normal critamount.

@Striging:check here
http://ro.thisisafuntime.com/
Guide for renewal
1st option, 2nd option = skillreset
2nd option, 2nd option = statreset
You have to have 0 weight, spent all skillpoints and have no cart/peco/ferus/falcon.
you made my day lol
thx

TeaRs
02-02-2009, 08:13 AM
Since AD is reducable by def/mdef. Does weapons such as ice pick, combat knife or mdef piercing related boost/affect the damage in anyway?
As Tea said and after some tests with hitting sleepers with hurricane icepick and a fortune sword (both 90 atk) i believe that icepick effect (and probably all other weapons with def piercing or amplified damage depending on def) only affects the weapon/equip atk, while leaving the statusatk alone.
On most monsters you are better off using high atk-carded weapons, only class that i can think of light now that could really benefit from icepick is assassins using a high atk weapon in the mainhand and icepick in the offhand.

Hmm interesting concepts RO is heading. Thanks Atum, for that informative insight.

Atum
02-02-2009, 08:39 AM
Hmm interesting concepts RO is heading. Thanks Atum, for that informative insight.
But dont forget that these are just quick tests, didnt have time yet to fully test it (also have to test it on players,they usually have way higher def than monsters) but my guess is that icepick effect only works on the weaponatk/equip atk, while status atk is unaffected.

Barigas
02-02-2009, 09:01 AM
I am quiet disappointed with Soul Linker's buffs: kaahi lasts 5 mins(instead of 30 mins) and all of his buffs (even on other players) are being dispelled if you enter any dungeon or if you enter priest's "Warp Portal"... :-(

rid
02-02-2009, 09:29 AM
Kaahi was never meant to last 30 min o.O'

It depends on the map... I wish it was nerfed even more so we wouldn't get those PVP-whores SinXs killing us in one hit with Soul-Linked EDP SBs...

Pa.rabola
02-02-2009, 09:57 AM
I am quiet disappointed with Soul Linker's buffs: kaahi lasts 5 mins(instead of 30 mins) and all of his buffs (even on other players) are being dispelled if you enter any dungeon or if you enter priest's "Warp Portal"... :-(

30mins is way too long. And it's not that the buffs are dispelled, it's just that you're changing servers. If you change maps, but stay on the same server, all of your buffs from a SL will still be there.