High thief, 10 Steal or Envenom?

[Divine~]

If i get steal 8 its 52% chance vs 64% chance at lvl 10

http://irowiki.org/wiki/Steal

If i get envenom 8 its 42% to poison and +120 attack, opposed to 50% chance to poison and +150 attack at lvl 10

http://irowiki.org/wiki/Envenom

What would be more useful for a stalker thats going to have 120 dex with buffs

[Feint]

Level 10 Improve Dodge, level 10 Double Attack, level 10 Envenom, Level 10 Steal, Level 8 Hiding, Level 1 Detoxify.

[saitorashi]

I say get level 10 Steal, Level 8 Envenom. Steal works better with high dex when you go hunting for stuff. Envenom is hardly woth even calling a skill. I never used it as a thief, rogue, high thief, or stalker. It's just a waste of a skill.

[Pantsu]

10 hide is more useful than 10 steal. Who actually uses steal anyway? The only thing I use to steal (on stalker or sinx) is edp supplies and my sinx with level 5 steal gets the job done. Envenom is good for statusing one specific person if you don't have a skilled that can do that intimed.

[Divine~]

I guess i'm not the only on undecided lol

edit-
1). I don't like idea of lower hide personally
2). I will have 120 dex so I think I have dex to back up the lower chance of steal 8
3). Envenom 10 has higher chance to poison, which I like the idea of

SO i'm thinking envenom 10, steal 8 but idk

[ASpirit]

You'll never use envenom, no joke.

[Bane]

Envenom is for using status weapons when you don't have enough hit. Other than that I really don't see much use for a higher level. More poison chance doesn't really matter when one green pot cures it regardless. Plus once you start spamming envenom in a pvp environment, all they have to do is switch to poison/undead and you're just helping your opponent out by missing them. I vote for steal.

[Shizuka_]

Like most of them said, I prefer 10 of Steal than 10 of Envenom. It's more useful, IMO.

[Sora`]

10 Hide, 10 Steal, 8 Envenom

Theres no reason why you shouldn't be having Hide level 10 on a stalker when you can move around hidden. On a sinx you could lower it.

Steal isn't required, but nice to have. I've gone to Geffenia and winged around stealing from Incubus/Sucubus now that you can teleport. Gotten one pair of wings doing that.

And I always preferred using a magnum break accessory when I played stalker to inflict status on an area of people instead of choosing one target. Even then, evenom isn't a high damage skill, and poison is one of the lower ranked statuses you want to inflict. Level 1 would suffice for that job

[Sho Lin]

Quite honestly, envenom 10 hide 10 steal 5 and you can go at like 47. envenom is fun to screw around with in pvp.

if you want to job 50 just do steal 8

[Pa.rabola]

What Sora said, 10 Hide, 10 Steal, 8 Envenom.

Envenom is useless, the only time I've ever used it is when I was playing around. Steal 10 has gotten me some pretty nice things <3~ And hi2stalker for Hide.

[Golden Fingers]

Steal > Envenom.

Admittedly I took Hide 8 since im a sin and get cloak, but envenom on a thief/rogue is only good for lvling as a thief/high thief. beyond that you'll never use it.

You can use a vs or vvs weapon to hit things for status effects with venom knife for range and poison.

*edit*

for a stalker, just take the minimum envenom required. It wont make any difference later on and you can still use it to spam status effects if you need to. going to J50 for L8 envenom is just a matter of taste really, you won't see the difference past the early levels.

[crash]

Are you really going to use Envenom for damage? I'd be happy with Envenom 3 just so I could get Detox on a Stalker. Anything more is either a waste of time or just silly.

[snowstorm]

Steal 10 Envenom 8

exactly what sora said, the biggest use i had for steal was geffenia pre-teleport so now it would be even better. and i used a magnum break clip on my sinx pre MA but for your stalker id rather magnum break > envenom

[Old Mandrill]

ive killed scholars and soullinkers using envenom ( in combination )

Seriously Hide 8, you're never going to need to hide for THAT long, and steal and envenom come in handy more often than you think.

Are you really going to use Envenom for damage? I'd be happy with Envenom 3 just so I could get Detox on a Stalker. Anything more is either a waste of time or just silly.
The envenom chance is really nice when using a mail/sword breaker, and you CAN do damage with it.

Raise your hand if you've needed to hide for longer than hide level 8, and you wern't just leeching.

[Divine~]

I think that i'll actually use envenom, and since i'm going to have 120 dex I think i'll stick with steal 8 :p thanks for the help though. I think it all depends on what build you are and what aspects of the game you are focusing on and personal perfernce, no one best choice

[Old Mandrill]

I think that i'll actually use envenom, and since i'm going to have 120 dex I think i'll stick with steal 8 :p thanks for the help though. I think it all depends on what build you are and what aspects of the game you are focusing on and personal perfernce, no one best choice

True, but I'm just letting you know from my person experience of playing a stalker for like....forever.

[Bluedreams]

Not that it matters much but for reference, on my sinx I went with hide 8, steal 10 (no choice on envenom :p )

[Xxelos]

Raise your hand if you've needed to hide for longer than hide level 8, and you wern't just leeching.

*raises hand*

Fucking sue me for being a creepy bastard along with being mostly useless in WoE so I just kinda sat in an emp room... for like half an hour... with a guild defending it... hidden the whole time... shut up. :sob:

[Sora`]

Raise your hand if you've needed to hide for longer than hide level 8, and you wern't just leeching.

If you're a guild leader than Hide10 is really nice.

[Divine~]

*raises hand*

Fucking sue me for being a creepy bastard along with being mostly useless in WoE so I just kinda sat in an emp room... for like half an hour... with a guild defending it... hidden the whole time... shut up. :sob:

Thats why I want hide 10, and I think that envenom 10 will be useful for pvp so that leaves steal 8 instead of steal 10

[Pantsu]

I've definitely been stalked in an enemy's emp room for 5 minutes and had to find a place to re-hide where they wouldn't find me.

[Old Mandrill]

Yeah I guess id be nice as a guild leader, but otherwise its really not a big deal.

But as a stalker im constantly switching between Stealth and hide, I wait in an emproom, hiding when someone casts some randomn spell, then when i think they will look for me, I sit in stealth in weird areas.

Bonus points for Stealth 1 and high int.

[Swifthand]

What I've normally gone.

Stalker minimum:
Hide 10, Steal 10, Evnenom 3, Detox 1.

SinX minimum:
Hide 5, Steal 10, Envenom 10, Detox 1.

In neither case have I ever, ever, used Envenom for much. If I wanted an attack that wasn't going to miss, Stone Fling.

[WK]

Enjoy stoneflinging that KEd guildleader. :(

[Swifthand]

You'd be surprised to learn there is only 1 guild leader on Chaos who was regularly KE'd and ever gave me a problem of that kind. I have screens of me stone-flinging pretty much every other guild leader out there. It's kinda cool, too, because the animation looks like I'm throwing a punch and if I'm close enough it's like I'm giving em a solid right hook.
Anyhow, my Envenom wouldn't do enough to break KE in either case, tested and proven on that one guild leader, believe me =_=;;

I'd have to bring along some crap bow that I don't own and even then, if I had a semi-decent Bow (some form of bloody), Envenom 3 would still suffice because the bulk of my damage would be from DEX anyhow.

[Saxy Lady]

What I've normally gone.

Stalker minimum:
Hide 10, Steal 10, Evnenom 3, Detox 1.


I chose this for my stalker. I considered going to job 50 since it was during 2x exp but then decided to just go to job 45. It's just a matter of personal preference.

[saitorashi]

Thats why I want hide 10, and I think that envenom 10 will be useful for pvp so that leaves steal 8 instead of steal 10

You sound confident about getting Envenom 10. Well, go for it if you really think Envenom is going to be more ground breaking at hitting people with status/breakers than a Stalker with Flying Kick or Bowling Bash WITH 120 DEX.

Wait, I don't know what I'm talking about.

I don't have a 96 stalker.

I've never played stalker.

But in all seriousness, just get steal 10 for the sake of having it later on. When you start working on other characters, or go hunting for EDP ingredients, Steal 10 makes it so you won't have to spam it more than once with your high dex, thus conserving SP on your hunts.

And Envenom is extremely situational; I wouldn't have to use it unless I lost my preserved skill. Though, what you do afterwards depends on your build. You need ASPD to make a good use out of envenom. My stalker has plenty of that but I still don't use it.

[Ichigo]

Level 10 Improve Dodge, level 10 Double Attack, level 10 Envenom, Level 10 Steal, Level 8 Hiding, Level 1 Detoxify.
my exact high thief build ^
job 50 or go home.
go with hide 10 and evenom 8 if you're going stalker though.

[Pa.rabola]

I think that's 99.5% of people's High Thief going SinXs build (job 50 ftw).

[Wingates]

10 envenom 10 hiding 5 steal.

[crash]

WHY. WHYWHYWHYWHYWHYWHYHWYHYWHWYWHY.

I don't understand why you people want Envenom 10. If you're using it for damage, kill yourself. If you're using it for Detox - you only need 3.

Sin Xs only get 10 for EDP. Stalkers shouldn't bother with higher than 8 ever - and that's only if you're somebody who insists on j50 High Thief.

[Old Mandrill]

WHY. WHYWHYWHYWHYWHYWHYHWYHYWHWYWHY.

I don't understand why you people want Envenom 10. If you're using it for damage, kill yourself. If you're using it for Detox - you only need 3.

Sin Xs only get 10 for EDP. Stalkers shouldn't bother with higher than 8 ever - and that's only if you're somebody who insists on j50 High Thief.

Because I use envenom way more than hiding for 30 minutes without recasting it.

[Naughts Skyway]

You can't steal in pvp/woe, and I never had -any- issues with steal at 5 for EDP supplies. Quite a waste in my opinion if that's all you do.

I used evenom for status effects, and very often. It never hurts to do more damage.

[WK]

Say you have all the time in the world, why on earth would you get Hide10 over 8 if you could just re-hide. Those +60 seconds of hiding time are not going to make a difference.

[Wingates]

WHY. WHYWHYWHYWHYWHYWHYHWYHYWHWYWHY.

I don't understand why you people want Envenom 10. If you're using it for damage, kill yourself. If you're using it for Detox - you only need 3.

Sin Xs only get 10 for EDP. Stalkers shouldn't bother with higher than 8 ever - and that's only if you're somebody who insists on j50 High Thief.

simple, i dont use steal.

[Feint]

Why use Steal when you can buy everything in the Kafra Shop...

Nah but seriously, no matter which skill build you choose, it's not gonna change anything. It's not like the maya purple hack abusers are going to watch you hide and follow you until you unhide, then scream "LOL HIDING 8 FAIL". The same goes to Envenom and Steal, no one's ever gonna figure out which level of the skills you are using, and no one cares. The difference is non-existent anyway :(

[Lane]

If you're a guild leader than Hide10 is really nice.


Recall self timer get.

Hide 10, Envenom whatever you want, steal 10 if you want - but since you have high dex you can chop it down lower.

Also, Envenom stays on my hotkeys always in PvP. Status weapons with envenom is win. Its a ASSURED 1 hit, and not an accidental second hit due to attack speed to break Ice *If you use a quad ice MG* Evenom ensures just 1 hit, perfect for being a fucking asshole with status's.

Full strip -> evenom with quad Ice -> Wind BB with Alice Doll+Sign = :o

[saitorashi]

Recall self timer get.

Hide 10, Envenom whatever you want, steal 10 if you want - but since you have high dex you can chop it down lower.

Also, Envenom stays on my hotkeys always in PvP. Status weapons with envenom is win. Its a ASSURED 1 hit, and not an accidental second hit due to attack speed to break Ice *If you use a quad ice MG* Evenom ensures just 1 hit, perfect for being a fucking asshole with status's.

Full strip -> evenom with quad Ice -> Wind BB with Alice Doll+Sign = :o

Yes, it is a sure hit no matter what amount of hit you have or flee they have (Unless they wear poison or undead). However, that is the same for all levels. The only difference in the levels is the chance of poisoning (which we can mostly agree poison is almost insignificant these days), and the never miss damage increases (and the amount of damage it gives is also very insignificant). Regardless if you use Envenom or not, it serves its purpose no matter if it is level 3 or 10.

[Pantsu]

Poison for reduced defense!

I like envenom 10 for nostalgic purposes when I used to kill people with back stab + envenom combos!

[MistressTifa]

Im sure that sp consumption on Hide 8 to 10 is a big difference, like TOTALLY, fck ya i'll be hiding all 2 hours of woe and my sp won't drain.

lol Hide 10

[Divine~]

Why do people put hide 10 down? Its the only thing a stalker has going for them, ie NO CLOAK and if you have to re-hide it just increases your chance of being found/noticed if you use it in woe. Who cares about the sp, its the time that people get hide 10 for

[OrderDisorder]

*raises hand*

Fucking sue me for being a creepy bastard along with being mostly useless in WoE so I just kinda sat in an emp room... for like half an hour... with a guild defending it... hidden the whole time... shut up. :sob:

Even if this sounds strange, imagine if he was the recaller of the guild, thats a very good chance to get an emp break.