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goblin~
04-12-2008, 11:03 AM
With stat resets coming sometime this month i have been wondering how good 99 agi is. Ive been playing around with a stat calculator i realized that 190aspd= 5 attacks/second. Which means mathematically if u had a mail breaker you would break the enemy average every 4 seconds assuming he isnt immune to breaking, which puts you almost on par to a MS. Also the new katars that came out look very nice with 190 aspd. The inverse scare will activate roughly every 6-7 seconds and the drill katar will auto cast on average every 1.5seconds. And If u had a quad stun speicalty jur and were melleeing a 0 vit character you would theoreticaly stun them every second. Everything seems good on paper but I have never tested this out myself.

I am wondering for you 99 agi sinxs out there if it is worth it and if crit lock actually exists at these speeds. I will need BC, agi stat food and IR to achieve this aspd, but igven that my guild is decent it isnt hard to get it during woe. I also do not intend to spam sonic blow or use skills with this build, its intention is to status inflict+ crit lock w/edp.

this is a video of what i am talking about:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9h-Y6b-Cm9Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrfmdCZpmmY&feature=related

Nails
04-12-2008, 11:10 AM
it might be easier to get AAR, Aid Beserk Potion, use Flapping Angel wings (like in the vid, not sure if u plan on using these), and ate an edp bottle (for attack speed, not Enchanted Deadly Poison!!). That could add enough attack speed sowhars you don't need BC... Just another possible way of doing it. Using the jur that causes 'critical wounds' or the one the inverse scare are probubly your best best imo.

Yuck
04-12-2008, 11:14 AM
Doesn't really seem practical.

If someone portal bugs dazzler you'll stand there for a long ass time.

goblin~
04-12-2008, 11:19 AM
It seems pretty practical to me, portal bugs aside the purpose of this build is to stop those GR users and hold people in place so the woe 2.0 guardians can close in on them. Another purpose is to cut down on edp pots and look cool in woe.

I could use flapping wings when not using infiltrator but i refuse to spend 10$ on a headgear for RO.

Simple.
04-12-2008, 01:03 PM
I hate when I watch something on YouTube, then you see all the other private server videos...

I guess it would work. If all you want to be doing is standing on cp or hiding and edp+Gt'ing. I could see myself going a high agi build if I had OH sunnies lol.

Nails
04-12-2008, 01:32 PM
I could use flapping wings when not using infiltrator but i refuse to spend 10$ on a headgear for RO.

how do you plan on using +10stat foods regularly?

goblin~
04-12-2008, 01:46 PM
2-3 agi stat foods/ woe is still plenty enough, afterall i receive 100 points everytime i subscribe. And besides 10$ is a pack of smokes... not worth buying a headgear over.

i know it seems novelty to have 190aspd, but think of how many people will fear you in woe knowing you can break their equipments and status affect anyone that comes close. You would be a mastersmith/ status inflictor in disquise. Using the new battle ground heroism katar will give me a nice 5% aspd boost effectively making my use of agi stat foods obsolete.

NOTE: there is no proof of that being a private server

Muse
04-12-2008, 02:23 PM
if you are really going 1 vit, maybe go stac gol top, gemini sunglasses, valk armor for 100% stun resistance

you'd lose out on aspd from flapping angel wings but it's probably worth it

Boni
04-12-2008, 02:25 PM
if you are really going 1 vit, maybe go stac gol top, gemini sunglasses, valk armor for 100% stun resistance

you'd lose out on aspd from flapping angel wings but it's probably worth it

This. I would actually love to make a 99 Agi crit sinx, but it's impossible for me to reach 100% stun resistance so I can't really do it. Also, sacrificing Str is also kind of shitty :(

goblin~
04-12-2008, 02:33 PM
my build still wil have 40+ vit.

Sacrificing str is a bad way to go agree, but the purpose here is to show the force of maximum aspd. You get a certain % chance to inflict status with katars, so the more aspd= the more chances that go off.

MistressTifa
04-12-2008, 02:38 PM
Suprising 99 Agi on a "Crit" SinX is not bad at all

Do realize the odds of WoEing with this shouldn't be top priority. Id base Crit SinXs with 99 Agi esp as just a MvP/PvM Build. Throw in BC and you got yourself a hot Crit SinX

rolypolybug
04-12-2008, 02:40 PM
It certainly doesn't seem like an efficient build, but it would definitely have it's uses. Personally, if I were going to go with a high aspd build I'd get low 9x agi. 190 aspd for critlock is serious overkill for a sinx using katars (that would be 10 "hits"/second including the offhand hit). Though less extreme, this would free up a lot of stat points for a more rounded build.

Sinx's with over 90 agi can be stun immune (without orc hero sunnies) for a few hundred mil, or can have 90% stun resist and also be able to quite easily get 50 vit. Even in large-scale fights you shouldn't be dying to stun easily with this much resist.

The point about breakers is moot. Mastersmiths barely even break anything these days. If you ask people, all their shit is broken by acid bomb. A 5% chance to break one weapon or armor while meleeing is a waste of time for a sinx.

However, the new katars do look good. I don't know what stats affect the chance/duration of critical wounds, but a crit sinx using a +9 wild beast claw will be doing 1-1.5k crits at 187-190 aspd with EDP and full buffs while also inflicting a -40% healiing/potting ability on the target. That sounds like it could take down/help take down a tank very quickly.

Again, probably not as efficient as an SB sinx, but I'm sure a sinx like this wouldn't be horrible as long as you have the gears for it and a good build.

Xellie
04-12-2008, 03:57 PM
Why hasn't my name been dropped yet? Hi. I'm a 99agi crit sinx.

There's quite a few videos of 99agi crit sinxs posted around lately? Oh its possible. It's probable. I've run around with 190 aspd in pvm its FUN. HOLY SHIT ITS FUN.

WoE? not prctical to get 190 aspd, you're sacrificing too much gear. I wouldn't base a build around crit locking tho... mvping yes indeed +_+ It's what I'm built for. and with a 6.6sec emp raping time, you can't really argue, provided you have the money/skill to play it.

Nothing says you have to have 1vit to be a 99 agi crit built though.

Sora`
04-12-2008, 04:31 PM
The point about breakers is moot. Mastersmiths barely even break anything these days. If you ask people, all their shit is broken by acid bomb. A 5% chance to break one weapon or armor while meleeing is a waste of time for a sinx.

Unless Aesthetic+Unity just don't like to wear unfrozens in woe I can tell you that I break plenty of armors in woe on my mastersmith

rene
04-12-2008, 05:05 PM
Many people don't own valk armors, even those from generally rich, woe-competitive guilds. Mastersmiths break a ton of a shit.

rolypolybug
04-12-2008, 10:09 PM
Unless Aesthetic+Unity just don't like to wear unfrozens in woe I can tell you that I break plenty of armors in woe on my mastersmith

That was meant as sarcasm, and aimed directly at the people in Unity/Aes/Defi that keep telling me only AD breaks their equips. Mastersmiths break shit, and so does AD. Either way you're wasting your time trying to break stuff with a sinx, which was the main point. Thanks for replying, though!

not fat bard
04-13-2008, 01:11 AM
Many people don't own valk armors, even those from generally rich, woe-competitive guilds. Mastersmiths break a ton of a shit.

I bet to differ, with the current market on iRO loki, getting the high stun resist is very realistic, seems like EVERYONE has a valk unfrozen/deadly these days.

Golden Fingers
04-13-2008, 05:08 AM
So all thats needed is 150 agi and about 105 dex. Does look cool with the hybrid jur he was using.

I'm looking forward to getting 190aspd with dual daggers myself though, thats going to kick ass. Need to wait for 12.1 dagger set, but at least its dropped by easily killed mobs.

Quick note on drill katar that doddler pointed out somewhere else. Yes you'll be proc'ing every 2 seconds or so, but the skill itself only has about 10% success rate so you'll need approx 20 seconds to disarm someone. The other Katars with AoE status should be awsome though.

saix
04-13-2008, 06:34 AM
99+15 agi is only 178 aspd

my advice?

Get 100-110 agi and be best friends with a minstrel ^^,

Wingates
04-13-2008, 10:14 AM
99+15 agi is only 178 aspd

my advice?

Get 100-110 agi and be best friends with a minstrel ^^,

a ministrel in your ass everytime? like they can keep up the movespeed...

Boni
04-13-2008, 11:06 AM
You could have 190 ASPD with 99 base Agi, 50 base Dex, level10 Agi and Dex foods, Ulle's Cap(Gemini Card), Undershirt+Pantie combo, 2 Brooches with Zho Pu Long Cards, Matyr Carded footgear, and Full Adrenaline Rush. In order to reach 100% stun resistance, you would have to equip a Valkyrian Armor, and you lose 4 Agi(and gain one Dex).

Without the stun immunity, it's possible to reach 190 ASPD with Flapping Angel Wings. You wouldn't even need all the Agi bonus equipment with the wings.

Nails
04-13-2008, 11:49 AM
Doesn't this concept make more sense on a stalker? Bow build that melee's with daggers (toothblade, mail breaker [3]), or status bows with a hybrid card and triple blow copied. Stat wise at least it would be much easier to achive.

goblin~
04-13-2008, 11:51 AM
Xellie, what kind of mvps can you solo? aside from amon ra i havent tried any other ones out.

ps a stalker cannot achieve 2 attacks like a katar or dual wield status daggers like a sin can.

Xellie
04-13-2008, 11:55 AM
With potions as no object? and without foods.

At 182 aspd I solo gtb, phree, hero, bapho, amon, moonie, eddga (possibly more, but those come to mind first)

I'm currently making a Battlechant slave and changing up my gears a bit to hit 190 asp or as close as possible and see what I can solo up with BC and foods. It should improve my mvp performance drastically.

edit: I'm planning on making a video of soloing bapho soon. Last time I tried it moron guildies decided to "help" >_> And I'm kinda low on pots atm.

Boni
04-13-2008, 11:59 AM
Doesn't this concept make more sense on a stalker? Bow build that melee's with daggers (toothblade, mail breaker [3]), or status bows with a hybrid card and triple blow copied. Stat wise at least it would be much easier to achive.

Stats-wise yes, but stalkers' damage output is nowhere near sinxs' damage output. A stalker could inflict status ailments just as good as a sinx, but the sinx would still be capable of dealing enormous amounts of damage with EDP crits and Sonic Blow. Not to forget the sinx could also kill MVPs while a stalker isn't really able to do the same(not any better than a Dex/Vit stalker, at least).

ChrisTurk
04-13-2008, 12:05 PM
With potions as no object? and without foods.

At 182 aspd I solo gtb, phree, hero, bapho, amon, moonie, eddga (possibly more, but those come to mind first)



Xellie dont forget to add all of the tokens you use. I have seen you mvp hero with sho SG'ing and you dropped a good 4-5 times with me watching. Im not saying you cant mvp it, but if he doesnt wanna drop 10$ for flapping wings im sure he is not going to pay for tokens.

Xellie
04-13-2008, 12:07 PM
Christurk, shut up, I uually do hero ungeared and without whites. I haven't done hero geared in forever. Normally cause I just Sonic Blow spam now or guildies call m up cause it's causing them issues levelling?

But wtf, I've never been mvping with sho O_o;; Ashai, yes, but never Sho.

I just spam pots. Thx.

but it turns out that 190 aspd crit will be more effective, faster and cheaper. O.o

vs Baphomet.

Combat Results

Hit Ratio 36%
Dodge Ratio 95%
Critical Damage 5783 ~ 6040(4780 ~ 4992+1003 ~ 1048)
Critical Rate 89.1%
Minimum Damage 3286(2716+570)
Average Damage 3524(2913+611)
Maximum Damage 3780(3124+656)
Damage Per Second 27002.64
Minimum Number of Hits 124
Average Number of Hits 124
Maximum Number of Hits 124
Average Battle Durration 24.8s
Average Damage Recieved 2662 (2349 ~ 2974)
Average Damage Recieved (w/dodge) 120.19Damage

ChrisTurk
04-13-2008, 12:35 PM
sorry xellie but i call bullshit... make a video of you killin him without gear or whites. NOW! and dont use your other server either, only iro chaos

MistressTifa
04-13-2008, 12:38 PM
Good thing my Paladin was on my Female Account

Xellie
04-13-2008, 01:02 PM
sorry xellie but i call bullshit... make a video of you killin him without gear or whites. NOW! and dont use your other server either, only iro chaos
Quit making drama. If I'm SBing, Im not carrying whites. I recently used up all the siegfrieds I had leftover from making the sleipnir. I also no longer have the +7 infiltrator.

Cheaper than whites.

And Sho, since when did I ever mvp with you? o_______o

Xellie
04-13-2008, 01:09 PM
psst okay fine christurk, I went and dug up a +4 bloody infilt. Gonna eat now, then I'll get hero time. Don't blame me if faggots won't let me solo it for fraps purposes.

ChrisTurk
04-13-2008, 01:40 PM
SO you use whites when you sb or no? cause you said
I just spam pots. Thx.
but you also said
Christurk, shut up, I uually do hero ungeared and without whites

im confused... when i saw you doin hero you were wackin it not SB'ing it

MistressTifa
04-13-2008, 01:41 PM
I never said u did o_O;;

Ayorius
04-13-2008, 02:00 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5gEgS0ilUw

Nice video MVP 190 aspd from Jro

Xellie
04-13-2008, 02:06 PM
Well if I dont have seigs I use whites? Genius? But I havent mvped for a while sin my old ISP shat out on me.

And if you saw me just whacking on it it, I dunno then. That doesn't seem very recent if thats the case.

@sho I dunno either, but chisturk said so O.o;;

ChrisTurk
04-13-2008, 06:20 PM
Well if I dont have seigs I use whites? Genius? But I havent mvped for a while sin my old ISP shat out on me.

And if you saw me just whacking on it it, I dunno then. That doesn't seem very recent if thats the case.

@sho I dunno either, but chisturk said so O.o;;


ok sho or not sho, just post a video Xellie

Xellie
04-13-2008, 07:20 PM
Watch this space.

Nails
04-13-2008, 08:07 PM
o.o hawt mvp vid!

As for the stalkers...they have the advantage of range and triple attack...which isn't as good as katars...hmm i suppose this really raises the question of how good the new status causing jurs will be.

Will they be good enough to invest a transcharacter into? :confused:
Will they bring crit sinx's back in popularity?:eek: Next ooooooooooooooooooooooon
the Rag Online!

no idea what just got into me, but it felt good:p

Xellie
04-13-2008, 09:07 PM
Uploading ^_____________^

Edit: Oh so I use a lot of siegs when I die?

All chars for slave buffs; are ones I have access to. Foods are accessible in game. As are endows. No kafra shop necessary.

This was with 189 aspd becuase I wanted to live. Will I post one with 190 aspd next hour?! Only time will tell!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBZdNVMUzPs

Direct download (higher quality) 15mb : http://www.iro-valhalla.co.uk/video/heronoheals.wmv

ChrisTurk
04-13-2008, 11:45 PM
wow, im not gonna bash you cause this is someone elses thread, but your video proves you use ALOT of whites.. dont say you dont use whites unless your gonna also say that you use tokens. Also dont say you do it ungeared plox .. kkthxbye

Xellie
04-14-2008, 12:41 AM
I do, but you were arguing that I NEED to use tokens.
I think I just proved I can do it using INGAME material only.

I'm not going to video myself doing it ungeared / no whites and spamming seigs atm because I HAVE EXPERIENCE. Dumbfuck. The only reason I DIE to hero is because I dont take gear / pots / or give a fuck.

Since I do care about exp atm, I thought I'd show you how I really do i when I mean it.

You questioned my ability to solo hero without getting owned because you've seen me when I've gone gearless on 0%. You claim I die a lot. I proved otherwise. Now kill yourself.

Get me 600 ranked slms and I'll do the same at Bapho ^O^

Kiniro
04-14-2008, 12:41 AM
Just pointing this out but usually =/= always. Just some fyi. Anyway. :rolleyes:

ChrisTurk
04-14-2008, 04:14 PM
well that video doesnt play for me past 60% :( on my media player

whos the guys who says "was that at least fun" at the end

Xellie
04-14-2008, 06:47 PM
then DL the full high quality version.
And that was Tey.

MistressTifa
04-14-2008, 07:21 PM
us ure that was 189? the stats at end say 187

Edit: nvm ur bless wore off

Xellie
04-14-2008, 07:43 PM
Lol I felt like such a noob when I realized how far through my EDP expired and how long I attacked without EDP up D:

To get 190 all I have to do is trade in flapping wings / rogue mant.

goblin~
04-14-2008, 10:27 PM
I do have a morrigaine set so i cant change up my headgears or robe. well thanks xellie and everyone who posted i guess ill aim for low 90 agi.

btw wheres a good place for 9x crit sin to lvl? i have a jur and armor for pretty much any place to lvl and my flee is around 230... however no i do not have ice pick

rolypolybug
04-14-2008, 11:09 PM
pasanas/CT HO's/magma

Expt626
04-15-2008, 12:56 AM
id3 works for crit sinx as well. Seen my fren's crit sinx 99ed himself down there.

Xellie
04-15-2008, 02:06 AM
Al3 is really good for crit sins. I levelled there a lot. Just use EP (everything else) /cursed water (gold acidus) to help speed things up ^^

Wingates
04-15-2008, 06:14 AM
Al3 is really good for crit sins. I levelled there a lot. Just use EP (everything else) /cursed water (gold acidus) to help speed things up ^^

Not crit sins xell, but agi sins. Monsters there hits like crazy :p

Xellie
04-15-2008, 12:33 PM
yeah you need about 270~ flee.

goblin~
04-15-2008, 07:40 PM
just wondering, how high a chance would that high dex sinx in the video have of full stripping a 0dex target with the drill katar?

Fred VII
04-16-2008, 12:48 PM
pasanas/CT HO's/magma

Rachel Sanc 1-2 is better than those places.

rolypolybug
04-16-2008, 12:56 PM
Yea I'm pretty out of the loop as to new places for leveling a sin :P

I'm not really seeing why they'd be better though. No element to take advantage of and around the same xp as pasanas...is grimtooth mobbing that good there to offset that? They didn't walk very fast iirc.

Silvanus
04-16-2008, 05:09 PM
If you're talking about Rachel Sanc 1 and 2, Yes. Just watch out for hodremlins...they'll make you pay if you're not careful...

Fred VII
04-16-2008, 06:00 PM
If you're talking about Rachel Sanc 1 and 2, Yes. Just watch out for hodremlins...they'll make you pay if you're not careful...

Eh, they aint bad, I grimtooth Hodremlins to avoid getting SBed by them. If you end up in that one room with Hodremlins and Seekers, definitely watch out.

Given To Fly
04-16-2008, 06:07 PM
.

Golden Fingers
04-17-2008, 12:01 AM
I didnt try rachel since they all have pretty high hp:exp and no element, so didnt look worthwhile.

I'll head down to AL at some point, i'd forgotten about that. And probably try thors again with the reduced int. Kaahi ftw

Given To Fly
04-21-2008, 12:16 AM
I was considering making a 190aspd crit build but I was wondering if someone who uses this build (Xellie perhaps) could make a list of the essential gears and weapons that are required. I don't want to make a character that I am not capable of financing. Thanks in advance.

Golden Fingers
04-21-2008, 01:45 AM
I'm planning on making one once the new slots are fixed up, pretty much just 99 agi + jurs. agi brooches maybe, although im probably going to use existing gears and settle somewhere around 185 aspd with decent str.

If you went all out its just a matter of focusing on +agi gear which is pretty cheap anyway. Maybe get flapping angel wings if you like that stuff, or pecopeco band before they fix it. Scratch that, i'm likely to get a moderate amount of dex to help with aspd, and im using chick hat, no question. That thing rocks.

Xellie
04-21-2008, 02:38 AM
Based on using BC or no?

Given To Fly
04-21-2008, 01:07 PM
Based on using BC or no?

Probably no battle cry

Fred VII
04-21-2008, 07:39 PM
Hmm, will you have high ASPD with Mass Murder Katar since its weight is 0?

Xellie
04-21-2008, 08:55 PM
Well I use HP and crit gear really. Brooches of counter and matyr boots. Peco carded Thieves clothes, baph.jnr card mant and flapping angel wings. I guess with < 99 agi you'd need male theifbug boots or something.

But in the face of an MVP I prefer HP gear

It's nothing too fancy to be honest. and the weapons depend on what you're gonna fight. I use a +10 double crit lib jur for all round use, but to be honest certain spec jur combos wok out better.

Nibbles
04-21-2008, 10:03 PM
Hrm... how about this for a concept:

4x Rapid Spec. Jur (Cecil Damon: +5% attack speed, -30 Hit ea.)
Aid Berserk
Full Adrenalin Rush
Flappy Wings

82 Str / 86 Luk / 68 Agi (reg. Assassin stats)

Should have a base crit rate of about 90% (inc. 2x Crit Ring, Gloria, etc.) with a 190 Aspd.

Even though your Hit should be shit, the crit rate's independent of it.

Xellie
04-22-2008, 07:55 AM
That luk is waaaaaaaaay excessive o_O
Even my nat crit sin has only 72 luk max.

Aiofe
04-22-2008, 10:30 AM
Well at least the luk adds a bit of atk. Otherwise, Nibbles, you're crazy.

Nibbles
04-22-2008, 11:17 AM
That luk is waaaaaaaaay excessive o_O
Even my nat crit sin has only 72 luk max.

Well, when you think about it, it has to be high to make sure you crit consistently, because you're not going to hit shit otherwise. At least with that concept setup.

houndog
04-22-2008, 11:41 AM
12.1 brings adds a slotted accessory that gives 3% aspd, as well as battle grounds set for for thief type, which adds crit +5, aspd +5%, and agi +3, also slotted accessories with crit +5.

Xellie
04-22-2008, 12:14 PM
you'll also die a lot due to lack of flee / vit

Mushironsha
04-23-2008, 09:09 PM
Whoa Xellie's criticizing someone for having too much of one stat.

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Xellie
04-23-2008, 09:17 PM
kinda funny huh? But since its a topic about 190aspd.... hmmm.

Cherub Resin
04-24-2008, 06:16 AM
You don't need that much luk true. Also with only cecil cards your damage would be super terrible. I'm not sure you can get 190 aspd but any sinx can of course use morrigane's set + 1-2 crit cards to get about 90%. Kaila uses spec jurs like Triple Bloody Killing or Triple Boned Crit (SSC for the ones that don't have a +7/10 crit card) with gloria and morrigane's set gets 85%+ crit rate. Because of the gear it uses you may not be able to get quite 190 aspd but wtf 189 is just as good.

Wingates
04-24-2008, 08:52 AM
Well, when you think about it, it has to be high to make sure you crit consistently, because you're not going to hit shit otherwise. At least with that concept setup.

My crit sin one had 100 luk, and it's not that good. You should balance between
luk and str as you would balance +crit cards and damage cards. The only good thing
about 100 luk is:
a. wearing 2x cursed brooch
b. dueling vs other crit sins (not sinX) and laugh at their misses.

MistressTifa
04-24-2008, 09:06 AM
I just stat reset my SinX to make it have 20 base Luk from 35 just because of the new gears coming out and the Crit Rate % I was already achieving. Maybe thats just me tho

Xellie
04-24-2008, 09:29 AM
I'm not sure if I should lower my luk or not. Morriganes set although nice, doesn't seem like that good of an idea at MVPs (loss of reduc gear, head/mant)
I have 37+8 luk for 45 total atm. I haven't really calc'd with new weapons but testing showed me certain spec combos are equal to my lib jur so....
Aaaah I dunno! >_< I wanna drop one aspd too, but I dunno if I could still hit 190 w/o BC then

Golden Fingers
04-25-2008, 12:28 AM
I use either triple 10/+7 or quad 10/+7 jurs so they're adding 21 crit, 30% dmg jur or 28 crit/ 40% dmg jur.

Granted, the damage bonus is only on crits, but if i could hit the MVP with any accuracy i'd be using SL-SB anyway.

In terms of the new stuff in 12.1, i think the battleground medallion beat the 3% aspd or crit+5 accessories, but that'll come down to user preference. Personally im going for BG with all the added bonuses.

*edit*

I didnt realise the BG armor is 5% aspd, has that been edited? the 3000hp/10sec would mitigate the 300% damage in most normal leveling situations i think. Might put alicel card in it, or +agi since it already has 3 agi.

izayoi
05-19-2008, 05:01 AM
no0b Question: what is lib jur 0.o

Atum
05-19-2008, 07:38 AM
no0b Question: what is lib jur 0.o
Liberation jur : A Jur (katar weapon) with one or more abysmal knight cards (+25% dmg vs boss monsters).
Abys knight card has "liberation" as prefix when carded in a weapon.
Double critical liberation jur = 2 soldier skeleton cards (critical) and 1 abysmal knight card (liberation).
Critical double liberation jur = 1 soldier skeleton card and 2 abysmal knight cards.

Nails
05-19-2008, 07:59 AM
190 attack speed would be easier to get with the thornshieild/buffalo horn. Not sure if this has been mentioned yet...

Ergroilnin
05-19-2008, 08:24 AM
Because you can easily equip katar with thorn shield rite?

izayoi
05-21-2008, 04:12 AM
wat is thorn shield ?

Ojimaru
05-21-2008, 06:44 AM
Thorn Shield is a new 11.3 shield that, when paired with the Bison Horn accessory, adds 10% ASPD and reflects 5% damage.

Swifthand
05-21-2008, 01:42 PM
Well the implication is a Crit Katar SinX but hey, Thorn Shield + Bison Horn + Double Crit Platinum Shotel could very easily yield 190 aspd. You'd only need around 90 base AGI if you had some DEX?

Ojimaru
05-22-2008, 12:34 PM
Except that going with the Platinum Shotel screws you out of Double Attack (barring Chick Hat) and the bonus from Double Attack for katars and the Katar masteries.

Xellie
05-22-2008, 04:25 PM
Why would you want DA if you're trying to crit to bypass flee and defence ......

Frost
06-05-2008, 11:15 AM
Why would you want DA if you're trying to crit to bypass flee and defence ......
Without katars, you'd lose 20% damage from your left-hand damage right?

Xellie
06-05-2008, 12:00 PM
If you're using DA, you're relying on hit. If you're hitting you don't need to crit. If you need to crit it, then you can't expect to produce maxium damage.

At least I think that's where you're going with that.

13attle
06-05-2008, 08:09 PM
2 Platinum Shotels means you have 100% crit + 10% more aspd from the sniper cards and that means you can just get 99agi and 99 dex for aspd :o

satetsu
06-05-2008, 08:23 PM
Without katars, you'd lose 20% damage from your left-hand damage right?

and 2x crit katar-only features

Whacko Jacko
06-05-2008, 10:15 PM
18X aspd build would be extremely cool using a Flame Lord Ring+Ring of Resonance Combo.

Golden Fingers
06-05-2008, 11:42 PM
Not so much for a crit build because you still need enough hit otherwise the skills miss.

For one with decent hit tho yeah its fun to watch :)

Just to confirm on something since this seems like a good enough place, does aid zerk pot stack with drinking edp bottle and does AAR stack with the bard song? Also whats the duration on aid zerk?

Xellie
06-06-2008, 01:42 AM
18X aspd build would be extremely cool using a Flame Lord Ring+Ring of Resonance Combo.

It is.

does aid zerk pot stack with drinking edp bottle

No, they are the same as eachother.

does AAR stack with the bard song?

No

Also whats the duration on aid zerk?

I think it's 15mins.

Swifthand
06-06-2008, 05:45 AM
On the note of Platinum Shotel, Bison Horn and Thorn Shield for aspd, a better overall build and class would be a Stalker. Doesn't involve crit, but you can get 190 ASPD with AAR (or Impressive Riff) and would only need 78+26 AGI, 48+22 DEX (AGI, Bless, Job Bonuses and the 1 AGI from Bison Horn). If you went 99 AGI, you'd have 185 aspd without AAR. Mixed in with Double Attack Lv10 and Trifecta your damage would go pretty damn fast.

I just calced it and a pure ASPD Stalker (with +9 Platinum Shotel) with decent points into STR (140 STR from Stealth Bonus) can kill a Gold Acidus in 11.92s. With AAR, the same Stalker hits 190 aspd and can kill the Acidus in only 6.11s +_+!!

Nails
06-06-2008, 07:26 AM
wow hot! Ya dag stalkers could do pretty damm well with that. Hmm what's the kill rate on say...an ice titan or emp for that build?
*btw Xellie nice sig xD

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 01:21 PM
hi i was thinking about the thorn shield and buffalo helm, and it says it adds 10% aspd right?

well with the stats being this:
str 21
agi 99
vit 20
int 1
dex 79
luk 47

your aspd will be 170 with the platinum shotel equipped. now if you take the 10% increase from the shield and helm you get 170*.1= 17 and thats the 10% so add 17 to 170 and you get 187. now if you add a couple cecil cards im sure you can well enough get your aspd to 190 without pots or boost spells.

and for those who want the katar if you apply the same stats your aspd will be 177 so if you use a jur [3] you can put a cecil card and the paper card (note with the paper card you'll need to apply the dancing dragon card, the shinobi card, the wanderer card, and the wild rose card) if you dont want to run the paper card set just put in another cecil card to get the 10% and use the 3rd slot for whatever. adding the 10% to 177 will give you 194 aspd with no pots or spell boosts.

please let me know what you guys think

ps:i play on valkyrie server

MistressTifa
09-26-2009, 01:50 PM
21 str, 79 dex,47 luk, 194 ASPD on a Crit SinX

you sure you aren't playing on a pserver?

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 01:57 PM
i dont have a sinx yet i was going to make one and im sure its not a private server. i was just seeing if my little theory on the 10% increase is true or if ro uses a completly different format. i was just using basic math to figure out the 10% increase to see what i had to do to get 190 aspd with no spell boosts or potions.

MistressTifa
09-26-2009, 02:06 PM
I thinkyou're missing the point

"Crit" SinX

first off

STR: your Str is abnormally too low, even at 190 ASPD, you're going to hit as much DPS as like a 40 str with lower ASPD

DEX: wtf is with your dex? If its just to get more ASPD then that is a horrible reason to get this much dex. Rather switch that value with STR and get a higher DPS. I don't even know what makes this a Crit SinX, you mite as well name it an Agi Shotel SinX.

LUK: You don't need this much luk anymore to get a good crit rate

194 ASPD: I don't get where you pull this value from.

ASPD Calc: 170 with Thorn Set doesn't boost you to 187 ASPD... your math is right but RO doesnt work like that. You gain at most off the top of my head 3-4 ASPD

use a RO Calculator first before plannin builds please.. especially if you're not seeing that you're gonna be seein a lot of crits for like 100 dmg at 400 dps instead of doing like 1200 dps with higher str and lower dex and a slightly lower ASPD..

not to mention Im not a big fan of Shotel builds on a SinX Either.
SinXs have a good Passive Katar Skill Tree (AKM, KM) for a reason. Jurs even give higher Crit rates also
Might as well make it on a Stalker and even then, I question the stats you mentioned.

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 02:13 PM
these stats were something i saw someone else have. it was something i watched on youtube and i wanted to see what others thought of the build before making anything

MistressTifa
09-26-2009, 02:18 PM
if you're referring to the MVP Video of the SinX or the LK (because both of them have the exact same stats) from jRO, thats fully Kafra Buffed, BC stated so they can deal with that. Are you wlling to commit to 24/7 having kafra food on and having BC Stats with you everywhere you go?

And generally Youtube videos consists of alot of PServer vids as well which might explain where you pulled out the 194 ASPD from.

Again, it's best to plug those stats into an actual RO Calculator (like RagState or Doddlers Calc, or the one on ROProject) before you write somethin here.

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 02:22 PM
so what stats and equipment would you suggest for a high aspd crit sinx?

MistressTifa
09-26-2009, 02:24 PM
don't be lazy, I see you constantly readin this thread so Im going to assume you have more then enough time to read other threads. besides the first 4 pages of this thread helps also

http://forums.irowiki.org/showthread.php?t=458

http://forums.irowiki.org/showthread.php?t=370

come back and write somethin after you've read those threads and plugged them into a RO Calc before wanting input from people.

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 05:15 PM
ok ive done some research and came up with a way to get aspd to 190 without party boosts and it only uses one type of potion.

stats

str 70
agi 99
vit 46
int 1
dex 40
luk 21

equipment
flapping angel wings(upper head)
sunglasses[1](lower head)/nightmare card
pantie[1](armor)/thief bug card
undershirt[1](garment)/baphomet jr. card
black leather boots[1]/whatever card you want
brooch[1]x2/kukre card

and using the enchant deadly poison(consumed)

let me know what you think

invertigo
09-26-2009, 05:23 PM
if youre going to use drinking poison bottle, wouldnt it be better to just EDP to get quadruple the damage? or are you planning to use 2 each time lol?

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 05:34 PM
well i'll most likely try to keep using 2 that way i can have the 190aspd unless if i use the sandstorm and desert twilight daggers and fill the with doppel cards and refine the black leather boots to 10 and get the odium of thanatos card, if the doppel with the twin daggers will even work. then i may do that but until i know for sure about that one im sticking to useing 2

MistressTifa
09-26-2009, 05:35 PM
ok the stat look alot better but whats with the gears?

You seem to be all about +Agi. I wouldn't recommend that.
and EDP Consuming, you're going to get broke pretty damn fast if u keep using an EDP just to get your ASPD up.

Did you look at any of the Morroc Seal Accessories? +3% ASPD, Slotted or the +5 Crit, Slotted
put a Ragged Zombie Card in and u get another +5 Crit and 1% extra dmg to Demis
its alot better then brooches, otherwise sure i guess that stat will work

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 05:38 PM
what calculator has all the new updates? the ones i find dont have everything in them?

MistressTifa
09-26-2009, 05:42 PM
is there some sort of obsecure reason you want 190 aspd 24/7 to the point you use a Poison Botte 24/7 as well?

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 05:50 PM
so i can have max aspd without having to worry about needing a party with me and not use too much potions given edp will take alot thats why im hoping the twin daggers sandstorm and desert twilight filled with doppel cards will be able to replace that, but the calculator i found doesnt have them as a weapon option.

MistressTifa
09-26-2009, 06:00 PM
so you're gonna be 24/7 EDP Buffed or ur gonna magically find Doppel Cards..
good grief I hope you have ike 10 billion zeny thatll last you like a few months

i never knew ASPD has anythin to do with party, god forbid people are gonna tell a difference between 186 and 190


Again, it's best to plug those stats into an actual RO Calculator (like RagState or Doddlers Calc, or the one on ROProject) before you write somethin here.

Google any of those 3...

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 06:08 PM
i was just trying to find a way to get max aspd is all. and im using the ro project calculator now.

invertigo
09-26-2009, 06:24 PM
:rolleyes: why bother sho

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 06:28 PM
so should i just settle with 186 aspd?

ok so heres the gear im going with

flying angel wing
sunglasses[1]/Gemini-S58
assassin mask
Valkyrie armor[1]/wooden golem
rider's insignia[1]/kavach icarus
sandstorm[4]x2/doppelganger x7, abysmal knight
death loop[1]x2/ifrit
black leather boots[1]/zombie

night_knight
09-26-2009, 08:57 PM
7 doppelganger cards? You'll never get that on iRO.

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 08:58 PM
just because it seems difficult doesnt mean its not possible

night_knight
09-26-2009, 09:06 PM
I don't think you realize just how "difficult" it is. Assuming doppelganger is camped 24/7 with gum, it would take years to get 7 doppelganger cards. And that's assuming you are able to get every single one.

Does anyone know how many Doppels have dropped on iRO Valk? How many of them are uncarded?

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 09:12 PM
ya i know trying to get them to drop them will be extremely hard but thats not the only variable, im also planning on buying some. and as the years part i plan on playing this game for a very long time cuz i find it to be very fun ^_^

night_knight
09-26-2009, 09:35 PM
Well, good luck with that.

I didn't notice the 2x Ifrit cards the first time... you won't be getting those, either. Unless I'm mistaken, none exist on iRO's normal servers. If you consider the drop rate on MVP cards and Ifrit's timed spawn, it's going to take about 15 years to get 2 Ifrit cards.

You can go ahead and hope that you'll one day have more MVP cards than anyone on iRO Valk, but you're going to be very disappointed. I suggest you don't plan on having MVP cards.

ZipZip
09-26-2009, 09:42 PM
why has no one commented on the fact, Valk has no sunnies[1] yet thats in his build. Reset your mid head gear.

Dont ever build around mvp cards. ever, or overly high graded things.

Infact you dont build around gears at all, That way your not gear dependent.


this is sounding more and more pserverish.


and p.s. the most dopples i've ever seen was that one HP/priest who solo'ed dopple on loki for like 3 years, before all the skills came, he had like 4 before the end i believe.

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 09:44 PM
the valk was there for the stun resist if it doesnt have the slot i can replace it with something else, it really doesnt matter

i changed the valk armor for a regular mantle[1] and the ifrit cards for kabold cards

night_knight
09-26-2009, 10:15 PM
ZipZip wasn't talking about the valk armor. He meant the server, Valkyrie. Slotted sunnies don't exist on that server. Nothing drops them, no one has them.

In a stat calculator, go for DPS instead of ASPD. Instead of the doppel cards, put in race or element cards and see what happens to the damage. It shouldn't change by much.

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 10:26 PM
well i can use a different headgear then.

what race or element cards would you suggest?

invertigo
09-26-2009, 10:27 PM
why are you guys still responding to this guy?

MistressTifa
09-26-2009, 10:30 PM
i stopped

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 10:36 PM
im just trying to get help on building my sinx

night_knight
09-26-2009, 11:41 PM
what race or element cards would you suggest?
It just depends on what monsters you're fighting. DD sinxs usually have a lot of different daggers, each with different race or elemental cards. It all depends on what you intend to be fighting.

Chaos Angel
09-26-2009, 11:58 PM
well i'll be mvping but i dont know what cards will increase my dps and what ones are elemental

ZipZip
09-27-2009, 12:01 AM
Dont build a sinX for mvping as your first char on valk.

It's far too costly, And the gears you need aren't worth it.

Make a champ, Fist, Die or bwing to inn, fill sp, warp back Rinse repeat.

Chaos Angel
09-27-2009, 12:19 AM
this isnt my first char i have a few other chars. im not an expert on the cards tho thats why i asked if you knew which ones increased dps?

MistressTifa
09-27-2009, 12:27 AM
how can u have a "few" other chrs and not know anything as basic as what cards do what

Chaos Angel
09-27-2009, 12:31 AM
if you know some cards that will help me then please let me know if not then dont put anything. i know im not that knowledgeable about all this but thats why im asking for help

night_knight
09-27-2009, 01:09 AM
Here's the page on the cards, specifically the weapons section:
http://irowiki.org/wiki/Card_Reference#Weapons_Cards_by_Race

Chaos Angel
09-27-2009, 01:13 AM
thank you

it seems that no matter what i put in there the dps is still very small

not fat bard
09-27-2009, 03:38 AM
I saw a 190 atk speed crit sinX edping on snipers in labs on Valkyrie, it was a very interesting sight.

Zeca
09-27-2009, 03:40 AM
you guys are getting major trolled

btw theres one doppel on valk i think

night_knight
09-27-2009, 04:36 PM
it seems that no matter what i put in there the dps is still very small
Try raising your str and lowering you agi.

dharma
10-10-2009, 02:16 AM
so should i just settle with 186 aspd?

ok so heres the gear im going with

flying angel wing
sunglasses[1]/Gemini-S58
assassin mask
Valkyrie armor[1]/wooden golem
rider's insignia[1]/kavach icarus
sandstorm[4]x2/doppelganger x7, abysmal knight
death loop[1]x2/ifrit
black leather boots[1]/zombie
God this is hilarious. 9 mvp cards and slotted sunnies ON VALK. This guy is an awesome troll. :)

Mekelba
10-27-2009, 06:40 AM
Go calc out how to obtain 190 aspd. And then, factor in that you need a moderate amount of crit. Then come back.

Oh, make sure you're realistic. This isn't a pserver.

Triper
10-27-2009, 08:26 AM
so should i just settle with 186 aspd?

ok so heres the gear im going with

flying angel wing
sunglasses[1]/Gemini-S58
assassin mask
Valkyrie armor[1]/wooden golem
rider's insignia[1]/kavach icarus
sandstorm[4]x2/doppelganger x7, abysmal knight
death loop[1]x2/ifrit
black leather boots[1]/zombie
God this is hilarious. 9 mvp cards and slotted sunnies ON VALK. This guy is an awesome troll. :)
I died laughing when i saw mvp+stupid and non sense cards there.:heh:

Neraid
10-27-2009, 01:09 PM
I dunno - 50% extra HP recovery from the zombie and Wood Golem cards will mean he has to sit way less often...

...

Kokotewa
10-27-2009, 08:45 PM
I saw a 190 atk speed crit sinX edping on snipers in labs on Valkyrie, it was a very interesting sight.
Was me!

Was mostly a test on what one could do with silly gears. Its /very/ ineffective without abrasive...and one of every stat food that exists.

Mostly abrasive though. 99str/99agi was the way to go on that build though, and it was a pvm leveling gimik if anything.

Infinite EDP/blues/mastellas/tokins/insurance/stupid rates->why bother clearing? ^^...

Were you the MS monk :P?