Author Topic: New Attack Speed Discussion  (Read 109895 times)

Offline Doddler

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New Attack Speed Discussion
« on: May 11, 2010, 09:23:15 PM »
For the purpose of keeping all the new attack speed stuff in one section so we can go through it and come up with a formula, I'm making a new thread!

Offline Adrian[Blade]

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2010, 09:31:31 PM »
cool so after atum posted the new aspd for the RK, did they drop the weapon penalty or change the formula???


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Offline Doddler

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #2 on: May 11, 2010, 09:33:42 PM »
Some quick observations:

- It's much easier to get mid-high range aspd on a character.  193 should be easier for some jobs.
- Skill and item bonuses are no longer increased by player agi.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 09:46:30 PM by Doddler »

Offline th3martian

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2010, 09:40:55 PM »
Quote from: Doddler;774588
Some quick observations:
193 should be easier for some jobs.

Does GX belongs on the "some job"? :rolleyes:

Thanks.


Offline Atum

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2010, 09:46:59 PM »
Aspd skills like THQ, frenzy, Adrenalin rush, etc are % based again, like pre-renewal.
This means the less aspd you have the more aspd you gain by these skills.

120 agi RK with 2hand sword without THQ : 181 aspd
120 agi RK with 2hand sword with THQ : 188 aspd

1 agi RK with 2hand sword without THQ : 157
1 agi RK with 2hand sword with THQ : 173

Aspd skills dont stack, so you cant use THQ+frenzy as 1 agi RK to get 190 aspd.

Offline Doddler

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2010, 09:52:05 PM »
More observations:

- Points needed to increase aspd seems harder as you get higher aspd.
- Items and skills seem to have returned to a % increase rather than fixed bonus.
- ASPD potions work without any agi.
- Some fixed bonus stuff appears to give lower bonuses at higher ASPD values.  Around 190 aspd I couldn't get any bonus from fighting spirit rune or celomane soup.
- Stalker has higher aspd with a bow than dagger. :o
« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 09:56:30 PM by Doddler »

Offline Frost

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2010, 10:04:43 PM »
Awesome. I've decided that my RG build will skip Spear quicken altogether due to its massive points requirement, but now it seems worth getting again with the aspd formula changes. Unfortunately, the only RG skill that benefits from increased aspd is Banishing Point.

Never mind. RG's aspd was nerfed.

I wonder how this'll stack with Assaulter Lance's +20% aspd bonus. /gg
« Last Edit: May 12, 2010, 07:44:28 AM by Frost »
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Offline Atum

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #7 on: May 11, 2010, 10:04:58 PM »
Rangers :
Equipping Bows gives no aspd penalty compared to barehanded.
EDIT : actually it is a penalty but barely noticeable.
If you have high agi you have no penalty, with 1 agi you lose 2 aspd.

118+4 agi,100+15 dex, awake pot = 184 aspd with bow

Aspd for Rangers with daggers is slightly lower than bows (~2 less aspd)
« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 10:11:09 PM by Atum »

Offline Filiolus

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #8 on: May 11, 2010, 10:13:38 PM »
Quote from: Frost;774622
Awesome. I've decided that my RG build will skip Spear quicken altogether due to its massive points requirement, but now it seems worth getting again with the aspd formula changes. Unfortunately, the only RG skill that benefits from increased aspd is Banishing Point.

I wonder how this'll stack with Assaulter Lance's +20% aspd bonus. /gg

Over Brands' 2~3 hits are separated by aspd.
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Offline Crossheart

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #9 on: May 11, 2010, 10:20:22 PM »
Everybody recheck!!!

I do a couple of tests, and all seems to give this: The penalization from weapon is affected by agi!!

Spoiler: show






« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 10:26:05 PM by Crossheart »


Offline Frost

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #10 on: May 11, 2010, 10:23:54 PM »
Quote from: Filiolus;774641
Quote from: Frost;774622
Awesome. I've decided that my RG build will skip Spear quicken altogether due to its massive points requirement, but now it seems worth getting again with the aspd formula changes. Unfortunately, the only RG skill that benefits from increased aspd is Banishing Point.

I wonder how this'll stack with Assaulter Lance's +20% aspd bonus. /gg


Over Brands' 2~3 hits are separated by aspd.


Forgot all about that! The hits should come out faster, but the dps is still the same though.
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Offline Atum

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2010, 10:26:03 PM »
Quote from: Crossheart;774646
Everybody recheck!!!
I do a couple of tests, and all seems to give this: The penalization from weapon is affected by agi!!
The penalty is probably -% based.
The more base aspd you have the less weapon penalty you get.
If you have very low base aspd you get a very high weapon penalty while having high aspd will allow you to equip weapons with low aspd penalty.

All weapons bonus aspd, weapon aspd penalty, potion aspd and skill aspd is reducing the gap between your base aspd (depending on your agi/dex) and the max point (not sure if they use 193 or 200 as max point).

However the alcabringer still gives +1 aspd per 2 refines so while getting aspd higher than 190~191 is incredibly hard with normal buffs/items/weapons this weapon gives you a fixed aspd bonus so its actually a quite powerful weapon now.

EDIT : Murasame gives +2 flat aspd regardless of the users base aspd.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 10:41:53 PM by Atum »

Offline Clogon

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2010, 10:26:13 PM »
Quote from: Clogon;774655
Ranger:
Bow +3
Dagger -6
Shield -9

Bow =D
Dagger =/
Shield =O

ASPD penalty from weapon reaches 0 as AGI goes up. AT 128 AGI:

Bow 0
Dagger -2

Shield Penalty remains the same.

Flat increase ASPD from Sniping Goggles remains the same.

Total result:
My ASPD decreased =/


I guess RK's and their multi flat ASPD increases got a huge buff...

My ASPD with High agi and etc went from 192 to 191. But ASPD at lower agi got increase quite a bit! without the Genetic foods I get 187 aspd.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 10:28:11 PM by Clogon »
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Offline Filiolus

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #13 on: May 11, 2010, 10:32:01 PM »
Now RG with 1+1 agi and 1+3 dex have 154 base aspd, -14 with two-handed spear and -10 with one-handed spear, with 99+1 agi and 1+3 dex have -11 with two-handed spear and -7 with one-handed spear.
Lvl 1 and lvl 10 Spear Quicken gives the same increase, 4 points at 1+1 agi and the same with 99+1 agi.
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Offline Atum

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Re: New Attack Speed Discussion
« Reply #14 on: May 11, 2010, 10:33:45 PM »
They probably want getting 180~190 relatively easy while getting 191+ aspd quite hard. I guess its pretty fair to make it so hard since increasing your aspd higher than 190 improves your damage output by alot (190 aspd ~5 attacks/sec, 193 aspd ~7 attacks/sec).

Also for RK weapon aspd tests ill quote Doddler from msn:
"mace is average speed for RK now
dagger is fastest, mace and 1hs tied, 2hs just a little slower
spears, even slower
[...]
2hs is fastest though with 2hq I think"

Finally the RK weapon aspds make sense so 2hand swords are the fastest ones and the stupid maces which dont fit the RK class anyway are slower.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 10:35:49 PM by Atum »