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Old 01-22-2009, 05:28 AM   #1
Ninamoir
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Question Lif: When to Recycle

I'm sure a few of you out there have dedicated yourselves to raising a Lif.

I've finally decided to raise a Homunculi, and Lif is my favorite, but there's the whole Loyalty vs. Good Stats thing. On one hand, it'll take 13 solid days worth of feeding to get it to evolve and achieve Mental Change. From what I've seen in screen shots, there are a lot of people who just AFK and feed their Lif until they evolve before leveling it. The highest I usually see them is in the 30's.

Is that really wise? What if you've invested all this time into a Homunculi who turns out to be horrible, stat-wise? Are you satisfied all the same, or are Lifs just so powerful with Mental Change that bad stats won't drag her down too much? On the other hand, leveling Lif before Mental Change is a bit of a pain. Is it worth bothering to grief yourself very far before focusing on the feeding?


I guess what I'm asking is, what is the point of no return on a Lif? Is it better to evolve it young (20~40 range) and just let it go however it will, or work hard to find one with good, enduring positive stat growth and evolve it later?

What do most of you all do, and why? I'm curious.


(also: excuse me if this makes no sense, I stayed up all night again and I'm a little out of it.)

Last edited by Ninamoir; 01-22-2009 at 05:30 AM. Reason: Clarification. o _ o ;
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Old 01-22-2009, 09:37 AM   #2
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

I didnt have a lif so far, but i would envolve her as soon as possible to get mental charge, which makes leveling her much more easier because the skill raises her atk by a huge amount.
Without the skill her atk is very very low.
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Old 01-22-2009, 02:03 PM   #3
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

The attack of a non mental charged lif is beyond abysmal. In their 30's, they're still hitting like a novice with the training grounds weap, and they only get exp for damage they do.

Personally i don't see the point of making a lif, honestly.
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Old 01-22-2009, 02:29 PM   #4
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Cool Re: Lif: When to Recycle

While I realize you are a well-respected and knowledge part of the Chemist Community, I didn't ask for your opinions on the validity of using a Lif as a Homunculus. Everyone knows that using the OP Vanilmirth is the best route, but this topic isn't really about Homunculus comparisons, as far as I'm aware. If you'd like to try and dissuade others from using the Homunculus of their choosing, by all means, start your own topic.

Now, if I could get some knowledgeable insight from actual Lif users? Atum's opinion is remarkably similar to my own, but I'm looking for someone with experience.

Last edited by Ninamoir; 01-22-2009 at 02:48 PM.
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Old 01-24-2009, 02:29 PM   #5
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

Actually either way you choose has its chance of success and failure, along with the rewards or the losses.

If you choose the evolve first way, chances are you're getting good growth in your 1st or 2nd evolved Lif, in which her leveling would be much much more convinient with MC. But as this takes up to (900x2)/6 = 300 non-stop hours, you better be lucky if you choose this path.

If you choose the leveling way, you could keep doing makeovers until you're ready to evolve it. If i remember correctly solid 7 days could bring non-evolved lif somewhere around 60s all the way in metalings, as which 60 is level generally agreed to be high enough to tell whether the homun should be kept or not. However as mentioned before, this process of leveling can be extremely painful.

If I have to choose I'd rather choose the leveling ways by setting up very high expectations for early levels thus lowering the chances of being disappointed after leveling her for many hours for crappy growth. Let's say by 25-30, your Lif must have 'Excellent' or 'Amazing' stat growth, else remake. That way will reduce chances of having to remake when it's already 40+. 25-30 should be done quickly in metalings so it's not quite difficult. When the very high standard starts to fall down steeply in her 30s-40s, it's better to remake then regreting it later.

As for my Lif i never remake it, i forgot about her stat but it's far from nice. For me what's most important from Lif is her urgent escape, as it has many uses in stuffs i'm doing in RO. MC is godly, but I used it rarely and 1k+ base atk is already more than enough for that. So, about 'MC being too powerful that stat doesn't matter' part, I'd say it's situational, depends on whether you really need it or not.

Last but not least, something that is often said, building up your homunculus is very subjective, depends on how perfectionist and dedicated you are.
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Old 01-24-2009, 02:50 PM   #6
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

Ahh; thank you, Dante. That's a good idea. I believe I'll follow the staging expectations route that you've proposed. O: 25~30 isn't too difficult, so I suppose that, with a little patience, I'll have a nice one by the end of this weekend.

I really appreciate your input. Lif is really versatile, isn't she? I tend to level in Rachel Sanctuary with a Spearman Mercenary and myself mobbing to Cart Revo, so I'm usually toggling my Peco Band/Alice Doll/Beret and spamming down Geographers every now and again when Aid Potting takes away my focus from actually clearing the mobs. So having Lif to speed me up, heal me, and occasionally fight with me is definitely what I'm looking forward to. I don't think I'll be limiting her to simply speeding me up. x_x

I'm more of a dedicated person than a perfectionist, so I don't mind to keep re-rolling to get a really nice INT growth, but I won't necessarily be a slave to it.

Thanks again!
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Old 01-24-2009, 04:29 PM   #7
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

I think, and I speak from experience, its a lot harder to screw up stats on a Lif compared to a Vanil. Her INT growth is generally high and that is really the only real important stat for her in the long run.
Even if it does screw up, it is simply not worth leveling her un-evolved. As for an MC Lif, I simply love that damage =)
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Old 01-25-2009, 02:30 AM   #8
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

I really like the urgent escape skill. I find it very useful if you need to lure monsters/mvps in harsh places like bio3. Thanks to her superb walking speed, I found Lif is the best homun for the job.

You see, no matter how strong Amistr, how agile Filir, they don't do you any good if, say, before mvp notices them, they are already flattened by other monsters. With help of Urgent Escape, you can force your Lif to 'charge' at the mvp, thus making sure it would aggro on Lif, ultimately luring the mvp.
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Old 01-25-2009, 09:23 AM   #9
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

I evolved mine @ 54. Then I have forced myself to unlock MC, first before I level her again.

I'm sorry that I'm a poor alchemist. /sob

Well raising a Lif up to 54 before evolving it is really a pain. Though I'm not the type of player that forces his/her Homunculus to monsters it can't handle. After summoning my Lif, I head over to Porings to gain enough Hit before proceeding to Prontera Culverts. After her training on bug extermination(late 20s), I trained her to go Wolf hunting. Luckily, she had beautiful VIT growth at that moment. She just laughs on how pathetic wolves bite. Then I tried tanking her to Metalings. I had to pick on a Metaling and run around like a little kid. I did that until she reached 54. Then I evolved her, did some testing with wolves and the rest is history.


She's now 68, turning 69. Used to have amazing INT growth but now it's like average. I don't actually care. What matters most to me is that she can kick a Vanilmirth's sorry butt. Though I still want a nerf on those overpowered blobs. It's very funny how Vanilmirth owners exchange aiding their blobs with White and blue potions, while I only throw White Potions on my Lif and no matter how they make their blobs run around to snipe my Lif with Caprice, they just can't match the MSPD of a Lif. I was like, is that it? Though I haven't tried dueling with a Filir owner. Though I think she won't make it due to Filir's insane flee. Only Vanilmirths can bypass that flee through magic.
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Old 01-25-2009, 02:32 PM   #10
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

Depends on the Vani, I think. Mine has off the charts agi. ;P
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Old 01-25-2009, 08:21 PM   #11
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

Too bad I don't have an iRO account so we can have a friendly Pokemon... I mean Homunculus duel. Though I think it's still doable... well after losing a fight or two. Then some minor AI tweaking and viola, another Vanilmirth butt trashed. Well, I'm looking forward to my Sphere Mine Customized AI for WoE purposes, but first, I have to join a fairly decent guild. XD
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Old 01-27-2009, 05:06 AM   #12
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

Hopefully this can be a little more on topic and help you some.

Lif stat growth almost doesnt matter. They all get decently high int which is all that really matters. On top of it even if your lif is on the terrible side of int MC itself gives you another 60 int, youll never see a 9x Lif with under 1k damage, it just cant happen with the physics of the skill. As for not leveling her, get her to at least 45. If you evolve below that youll be able to hit for 800 damage but only have like 50 hit, so anything that will give you decent exp you just wont be able to hit. If youre just going to AFK and feed it at least throw her in culverts or bylan and pick up 5-6 free levels over the 2 weeks it takes to get MC. If you feel those maps are too DB prone and choose to feed her in town you could always do metalings or something once she gets MC.

I evolved my Lif around level 35 and found myself frustrated with the huge damage and low hit, anything reasonable for her to kill she would one shot and anything that would give good exp she'd miss miss miss.

Keep it up Lifs are the most fun non-AFK homun's and there arnt enough around! Youll be rewarded in the end with a fun pet to play with
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Old 01-27-2009, 05:59 AM   #13
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Smile Re: Lif: When to Recycle

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xoldin View Post
Hopefully this can be a little more on topic and help you some.

Lif stat growth almost doesnt matter. They all get decently high int which is all that really matters. On top of it even if your lif is on the terrible side of int MC itself gives you another 60 int, youll never see a 9x Lif with under 1k damage, it just cant happen with the physics of the skill. As for not leveling her, get her to at least 45. If you evolve below that youll be able to hit for 800 damage but only have like 50 hit, so anything that will give you decent exp you just wont be able to hit. If youre just going to AFK and feed it at least throw her in culverts or bylan and pick up 5-6 free levels over the 2 weeks it takes to get MC. If you feel those maps are too DB prone and choose to feed her in town you could always do metalings or something once she gets MC.

I evolved my Lif around level 35 and found myself frustrated with the huge damage and low hit, anything reasonable for her to kill she would one shot and anything that would give good exp she'd miss miss miss.

Keep it up Lifs are the most fun non-AFK homun's and there arnt enough around! Youll be rewarded in the end with a fun pet to play with
That's definitely the kind of input I was seeking. Thank you!

The Hit issue is a valid one; I was too worried about damage to consider it appropriately. The one I'm raising for evolution currently has pretty good Dex growth; I think that if I level her for at least an hour a day or more on Metalings, she'll have some very sexy Hit.

DBing is not an issue in LOL-Iris. The population is so thin, there's almost no chance of seeing anyone outside of Louyang, Prontera, and the few guild gathering spots.
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Old 05-05-2009, 08:44 PM   #14
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

I agree with Xolden. However, to err on the safe-side, I leveled my Lif to 36 before evolving her (at which point she gained Amazing INT, VIT, and DEX levels). She's 50 now and has sadly had a bit of a retarded streak for the past few levels, but you know what? It doesn't matter because between the Urgent Call-Vaporize-Recall trick and Mental Charge (the great equalizer) she still tears up mobs like a pro. In that respect Lif is far more forgiving of less-than-stellar stat growth than, say, Vanilmirth (the Vanilmirth I 'lost' in the transfer from oRO to iRO had solid stat growth until taking an absolute nose-dive in STR and INT around level 60).

Even if her INT growth doesn't move back to the Excellent/Amazing threshold within the next few levels I'm not not going to "recycle" her. I only recently returned to the game and I honestly don't have the patience to double-loyal another Lif!

Best of luck! :-)
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Old 05-05-2009, 11:05 PM   #15
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Default Re: Lif: When to Recycle

I evolved my lif around 30, and never looked back. By the time she hit 95 or so she hit the magic point of killing a bathory in 4 hits without help... which made leveling quite a breeze since bathories did almost no damage to her.

The only thing that would be annoying is if they ever fixed the skill delay to be there no matter what... did they do that yet?

For old time's sake:

http://forums.irowiki.org/attachment...4&d=1191821035

Wow, doesn't seem like it was so long ago
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